classic or 2nd hand C?

[c mode]

Thought I'd tap into all the wisdom here. Which is better in your opinions, a classic virus, or 2nd hand C? They are roughly the same price to buy on e-bay. (the C is a little more). Just wondering If I'll regret the classic as it has a few less options.. Plus Virus seem to be changing the product line to phase out the older syths a,b,c etc. Hmmm. Musically I tend to go through waves, glitch hop, dub, deep house, progressive trance. I expect the new machine to be a staple of my home studio...

[Onkel Dunkel]

It depends on if you wan?t the extra features of the C. Both are great synths and either way you will get the Virus sound. The Classic is actually "just" a B in a new wrapping. Check: http://www.accessmusic.de/comparisonchart.php4 for the differences. Anyway, a second hand C (in good condition) is still better than a Classic due to the extra features and the more polyphony...

[c mode]

Yeah the C has a little more polyphony, which I think I can get around. Its easy enough to layer up sounds from it on a sequencer program for example. Not quite as elegant but it'll work.

Apart from that the only major difference is the number of Mod Matrixes, which to be honest I have no idea about. How important are they anyway? I know more is best but what would the C enable me to do with the extra 3 sources?

[Onkel Dunkel]

I know more is best but what would the C enable me to do with the extra 3 sources?

Just about anything :twisted: You can route just about any parameter to any source for interesting and wild things. Make one parameterchange control another etc. Only the imagenation limits you. Some sounds from the C won?t sound the same on a B because of this. Anyway you will get EQ?s on every channel, Moog-filter and more polyphony is alway good. Actually i tend to use less unison than i really like to because i don?t want to run out of voices and that?s on my C :? I actually thought the same question to myself when i wanted to buy a Virus and i don?t regret that i ended with a C. If you wait some months the C might fall in price when the TI comes out. But if you can live with a Classic then this is also a great synth. The C just adds more flexibility...

[ledge]

The moog filters are really really nice as well, if the price is similar i'd take the c.

There is always a risk with second hand gear, but it seems to be most people's opinion that virus' are pretty hardy, so you shouldn't have any problems there.

[Hamstar]

I would definately go for the c if I were you. I bought a virus indigo a few months back and the virus cs were only just a little more expensive. If I could go back I would have saved just a little more for the virus c because it does sound alot better than the b.

[c mode]

Ok, good info all around. Definitley the C takes the cake by all accounts.

I've decided to buy a classic tho..(shock! Horror!).

I'm living in Tokyo at the moment and prices here range from 180,000yen-206,000 for a new classic. I made a deal with an online music shop...hehe. They had advertised cheap N.A.M.M demos but had sold out..they offered a new boxed one for the discounted price. This works out to be 97,000yen including shipping. So I've saved half the price. I figure I can get a taste of the virus sound, sell it second hand here in Japan and still make a profit..maybe then I can get a C.

I'm just unsure about any hidden trade tarrifs or taxes. I'm guessing I'll have to pay something as Japan must really protect their electronics industries to the hilt. Otherwise this place would be filled with cheap chinese knockoffs. On that note there may even be a day when the Virus is copied.... well ok maybe not for a long time but thats an interesting idea.

Anyway if anyone knows about the Import fees etc let me know.

Thanx all. :)

[Hollowcell]

Ok, good info all around. Definitley the C takes the cake by all accounts.

I've decided to buy a classic tho..(shock! Horror!).

I'm living in Tokyo at the moment and prices here range from 180,000yen-206,000 for a new classic.

Anyway if anyone knows about the Import fees etc let me know.

Thanx all. :)

First off - too expensive for the classic in Japan. I bought my C new for 240,000 when it was top of the Access range about a year ago. You can get Cs for much cheaper than that now. Much, much cheaper!

As far as import laws go for Japan. I was told that musical instruments evade the importation taxes (even electronic instruments).

One thing though, you being in Tokyo specially, I would forget about new stuff all together. The second hand market is bloody excellent in Japan - I wish I didn't buy the VC when I did now. For the same money I could have bought things I would have never gotten at home! Hind-sight is always clearer though. :cry:

EDIT: Tell you what, if you would pay 200,000 for a second hand C (never gigged, smoke free studio use only), let me know. :wink:

[c mode]

Well basically you are right. Second hand gear here is fairly cheap and generally excellent quality. Theres some great stuff in Akihabara as I'm sure you know.

The Classic prices I quoted were for new ones from shops in shibuya. Ishibashi and Rock on actually. They throw on a hefty profit for sure. Still I can make a buck or two myself I think.

I saw an sh101 second hand at Ishibashi for 30 000yen. Seemed an ok price for such and old (but still handy) synth. Don't have the table top space tho..

Anyway let me put your offer on hold till I get the classic. I'll see what its all about, then if I outgrow it I'll hit You up for the C. I'm guessing you'd like to upgrade to a Ti?

Do you know the japanese list price btw?

Cheers!

[DIGITAL SCREAMS]

HC...if u hadnt of bought the VC...what would you have bought? Im guessing a Jupiter 6 for starters. THey are cheep in ur neck of the woods. Japanese analogs go for alot more over here in the West. Just as the american poly's (sequential, oberheim etc)....go for alot in asia.

DS

[Hollowcell]

Well basically you are right. Second hand gear here is fairly cheap and generally excellent quality. Theres some great stuff in Akihabara as I'm sure you know.

For sure! Some of the better ones seem to be in the "cooler" towns though I rekon.

The Classic prices I quoted were for new ones from shops in shibuya. Ishibashi and Rock on actually. They throw on a hefty profit for sure. Still I can make a buck or two myself I think.

Yep, Ishibashi does crank up prices (in Tokyo specially), but I bought my Roland HPD15 drum from them (shibuya store) and pushed them down 14000yen - took work though!.

I saw an sh101 second hand at Ishibashi for 30 000yen. Seemed an ok price for such and old (but still handy) synth. Don't have the table top space tho..

Not a bad price, but they go for much cheaper on the auctions and stuff. 101s have risen in price by double since I've been here. 8O But Junos have dropped sharply.

Anyway let me put your offer on hold till I get the classic. I'll see what its all about, then if I outgrow it I'll hit You up for the C. I'm guessing you'd like to upgrade to a Ti?

No problem. The quickest thing to out grow will be the voices - even on the C there isn't enough. Then there are the filters (that's more personal taste though). If you put on an extra 1man yen, I'd even bring it to tokyo for ya. :wink:

And yeh, upgrading to a TI would be nice. Not sure if I could do that straight away though - I'd wait for a year to see if the bugs get ironed out first.


Do you know the japanese list price btw?

No I'm not sure now. The only price list I had was for when I bought mine. The prices were very inflated on that list though.

HC...if u hadnt of bought the VC...what would you have bought? Im guessing a Jupiter 6 for starters. THey are cheep in ur neck of the woods. Japanese analogs go for alot more over here in the West. Just as the american poly's (sequential, oberheim etc)....go for alot in asia.

Outboard, outboard and then a little more outboard. I may have grabbed an MS2000 and ION in there too though. :D

To buy good condition older analogues, it's more a waiting game. If I see good ones pop up I'll grab them any way. I could sell them at home for much more, so it's like investing.

[Gopal]

My comments on the topic would be:

If ya lookin to save some cash, get a second hand B rather than a new classic. Basically the same synth for less than half the price (sometimes) then either wait for the TI or spend the balance on other gear.

I don't really need any more that 24 voice polyphony as I only make the virus do one thing at a time so the C just isn't worth the extra money to me just for eq (can do that with the desk) and a moog filter (which would be nice, but not as useful as a whole new synth for the same money)

I'm personally going to keep my B even if I get a TI one day because I guarantee they will be different sounding machines. And might actually compliment each other really well.

Besides, I'm a collectaholic and I like owning old school gear.

[c mode]

If ya lookin to save some cash, get a second hand B rather than a new classic. Basically the same synth for less than half the price (sometimes) then either wait for the TI or spend the balance on other gear.

Yeah true that. B's are going pretty cheap. Actually it's real tempting to spend the money I would save on more gear. At the moment I'm trying really hard to keep my set-up small, minimal, and good quality. Generally the more gear I get the more I waste time messing around without getting anything done.. but it's hella fun.

I don't really need any more that 24 voice polyphony as I only make the virus do one thing at a time so the C just isn't worth the extra money to me just for eq (can do that with the desk) and a moog filter (which would be nice, but not as useful as a whole new synth for the same money)

I kinda work the same way. But I'm hoping to get more into tweaking things on board a little. :twisted:

[Hollowcell]

I don't really need any more that 24 voice polyphony as I only make the virus do one thing at a time.

I don't use the C in multi-timbral mode much either. But alot of voices are a must for the Virus synths. If I'm making a bassline or lead sound, I'll run heavy unsion with no detune or pan spread just to get a more powerfull sound. I couldn't imagine having less voices than the C actually - at least sometimes I can layer a few sounds together :cry: .....Infact voices are one of the nicer points with the new TI.

[DIGITAL SCREAMS]

Id have to agree with HC on the voices. The Virus really does benefit from unison mode......pads, leads and bass all require it imho.

On the 24 note versions you can easily find yourself with 8 note poly for pad sounds.....thats a little tricky if your using long sustaining tri chords or whatever you call them.

DS