FOR THOSE HAVING TROUBLE WITH THEIR TI (Please Read)!

[Tarekith]

This is a repost of something I wrote for the VirusTI.com forums:
-----------------------------

Ok, so it seems like there's people on this list who are still not able to get the Virus working properly with Virus Control. I wanted to sum up some possible things to try if you haven't yet. These are not official Access recomendations, just some things that have seemed to help others experiencing these types of issues. You may not choose to try these, but doing so will hopefully help us all narrow down what some of the problems are. Yes in a perfect world none of these would be neccesary, but it's not a perfect world, and thus I'm trying to help in any way that I can. So, here goes:

1. Reinstall XP after a fresh format of your hard drive. GASP, yes this can be a pain but it's the only way to rule out all other software or drivers that can be causing problems with the Virus Install or USB port conficts. After you reload XP, and whatever service packs you use, load ONLY the newest version of the Virus Software. IF you get it working, then slowly start reinstalling the rest of your software, testing the TI stability every so often to make sure it's still working.

A note on XP Service Packs: Access recommends SP2 as it included some general fixes for USB audio transfers on XP. This is not always required though, as some people have V-C working just fine with SP1 too. Still, if you have not tried SP2, it's worth a shot. I still recommend a fresh XP install before you load it though.

2. Make sure your motherboard BIOS is up to date, especially if you are using the USB ports built into it. Also make sure you have the latest chipset drivers for your PC too. If you're using an AMD system, these will most likely be the VIA 4 in 1 drivers, otherwise they will probably be Intel drivers. This is IMPORTANT as these drivers directly govern how USB transfers take place on your motherboard!

3. If you are using a PCI to USB card, then make sure that the firmware and drivers for the card are up to date. If you are using a USB port on your motherboard instead and are still having problems after trying #1 and #2 above, then it might be worth buying a PCI to USB 2.0 card. These are only about $10-15 and have solved issues for quite a few people. Sometimes the onboard USB ports get assigned IRQ's with critical processes (system timer, graphics, memory bussing, etc), and this might put your USB transfers on their own dedicatd IRQ. A benefit of these cards, is that you can swap them out to different free slots on the motherboard too, and this will usually force different IRQ's as well, Make sure you go to the manufacturer's website and get the latest drives for the card if you buy one though, don't assume the drivers on the CD that come with it are the latest.

I know, I know, no one wants to go out and buy MORE things to try and get their synth working. But if $15 means you can now use your $2500 TI fully, then isn't it worth it? I'd be willing to bet this fixes 90% of all user problems. I would recommend buying from a place with a good return policy anyway, like Newegg.com or CDW.com. At least that way, if the card doesn't help your situation, you can return it and not be out any additional cash.

4. Try a different USB cable with the TI. Yes, it's unlikely that this is the issue, but you never know and the point of all this is to narrow down the problems. Takes two seconds to test, so I would recommend swapping out the USB cable that came with the TI for the shortest one you have on hand, See if that helps.

5. One final note on IRQ sharing. While it may be ideal to have the USB port used for the TI on it's own IRQ, this is by no means absolutely required to get things working properly. My USB IRQ is shared with 3 other devices and works just fine. So if you're going to experiment with forcing your USB port to a certain IRQ via your BIOS, don't get discouraged if you can't get it assigned a unique IRQ. The best you can hope to do is try and get the USB port assigned to any OTHER IRQ's, and see if that works. If you are doing a fresh XP install, do not follow the years old advice to install XP in "Standard Mode" versus ACPI mode (the default). If you don't know what this means, then don't worry about it smile.gif


One incredibly beneficial thing about the internet, is that it provides places like this where people can go to get help from other users. Unfortunately it also provides a place where people can vent their frustrations to (sometimes) willing ears, even though this does NOTHING to speed up any troubleshooting or solve the issues at hand. If you are still having troubles after trying these tips, or just feel like venting in general, I ask that yo PLEASE use another thread to do so. I'm taking time to try and help people out, at no benefit to myself. I hope that people can keep this thread on topic and somewhat positive, or at the very least civil. If you really feel the need rail and moan at Access, I would appreciate it if you could do it in a new thread.

If any of the above fixes improve thing on your end, please post here and let others know!

[Khazul]

Just some things to add to Tarekiths very useful post:


If you do choose to go down the Re-install the OS route - try out with miminal apps and utilities installed first.

I typically install as follows:

Base OS install (with SP2 and actvate)
Video/audio card drivers
Then goto windows update bring the machine completely upto date.
Disable any startup apps and servuces I know I definately wont need.
Check the basic ASIO, MIDI and minimal audio apps are working OK.
Configure windows update times to be non-instrusive, same with antivirus and anti-spware of you installed those as well.

Now I will image the machine. If you dont have a imaging tool (For eg Ghost), create a named system restore point. Leave system restore active - dont disable it - it can save your ass when everything goes horribly wrong after installing something :)

Now Ill install and check remaining audio/midi drivers for other devices, main audio apps etc ie bring the whole machine upto your normal DAW working set of applications and drivers etc.

Check it out, if happy, create another image or named restore point.

Finally I'll now start sticking all the other general working crap on that I need - Office 2003, Printer drivers, Visual Studio 2005 and tools etc etc, create restore point as I go along in case some part of it goes wrong/messes up the audio in some way and I need to roll back to the previous restore. As I am in complete control of creating the restore point up until this time, then I know exactly what I am restoring back to.


Also worth considering dual boot. My main DAW was installed as a dual boot - two hard disc partitions, Win XP+SP2 installed on each, and brought upto the first restore point above. My main boot is my general use PC. The secondary boot is very carefully controlled and is specifically for DAW use. In practise, I dont find much of a perf or reliability difference between my general setup and my optimised setup.

[Tarekith]

Not to disagree, but I think system startup and services should be left alone for this, especially services. Very easy to accidentally stop a service you think is not critical when it really is.

I used to get into trying to maximizing performance by turning off services, and to be honest it never made a lick of difference to performance or boot time in my tests. Now I just leave those service alone.

Startup items are certainly something to worry about once you start installing other apps, but my point in this post was to minimize any other program/driver interactions by only installing XP and SP2 and then testing the TI and Virus Control. Obviously if it all works well with only the minimum installed, then you know your issues are with other programs and drivers interferring with the TI and you can troubleshoot from there.

[Threlly]

Re-installing the OS !!!!
Isn't that a bit like swatting a fly with a Buick ?
Instead, I suggest you all go out and buy a Mac, MUCH less problematic.

[Tarekith]

Actually, I daresay it's the Mac users with the most requests for help. PC user's running SX3.1 generally seem to have the least amount of problems. Notice I said 'generally', so we don't need SX users chiming in saying their systems don't work.

If the issues you are having are small enough that they seem "fly-like" to you, then it's not probably really an issue eh? Reinstalling the OS is NOT that hard, nor does it take that much time, provided of course you have all your important data backed up properly (which you should be doing anyway). If it makes your TI work perfectly, or a least noticeably better, than I can't help but think it's time well spent no?

Personally, I think all computer based musicians should be doing fresh installs regularly (3-6 months) to keep things running smoothly and bug free. If you use an imaging program like Norton's Ghost, this is VERY easy to do. Once you have XP and SP2 installed, tweak the OS the way you want, and then make an image file of that partition. Now, whenever you want to do a fresh install of your apps, it only takes like 5 minutes to reimage the drive with this ghost, and then you can reinstall your apps and drivers. Or you can wait until you have all the apps installed to make a ghost, to save even more time. I do both.

[Tarekith]

Also, this is my list of XP Tweaks that are safe for Music PC's running XP:

http://tarekith.com/assets/XPTweaks.htm

[Threlly]

Let me clarify.
I have PC with XP SP2 and a Mac.
I would consider the idea of re-installing the OS that often as nothing less than crazy.
If you perceive a problem with your fuel pump, do you rip the whole engine out.
If you insist on this route, can I suggest you restore your partition to a plain vanilla state from a cheap external HD.
It'll save the ballache of driver installs for a start.
Also, if you have to do this that often, it suggests another more fundamental problem.

[Tarekith]

Ok, I'll clarify my view then :)

I never feel the need to HAVE to do this, my system is stable and pretty much never gives me an issues anymore. I do it to more as preventative maintenance, so that when I'm flowing and the music is happening, I don't ever have to worry about PC conflicts slowing me down. When I'm in a rut and having trouble writing music, I'll maintain the PC and do other boring studio chores. Obviously if I haven't installed any new drivers or software since the last install, then I don't need to worry about. With things like Ghost, this is a ten minute process for me, well worth the time for the piece of mind.

I think we're getting sidetracked anyway on this issue. This post really is less about routine maintenance, and more about troubleshooting immediate problems people are having with the integration of their TI's.

I'm not singling any people out here, but the people I've tried to help off the forum in private 'generally' seem to have neglected most PC related upkeeping.

- They have Bestbuy bought PC's with all the original software installed.
- They've never run a virus scan, ad-aware, spybot or the like.
- They've never checked for updated drivers or a new motherboard BIOS.
- They do not know what an IRQ is, or why it could be an issue.

I'm just trying to help people out who may or may not know about this stuff. Like I said in my first post, reinstalling the OS can seem drastic, but if it's been years since you did this, I truly believe it's worth spending the time investigating this. If it makes your system more stable and gets the TI working, then I believe it's well worth it.

The TI is not a bug ridden beast for everyone universally, so I'm trying to eliminate potential causes of bad interactions, and hopefully help people get things working as smoothly as they are for me.

I truly hope people will not bitch and bicker in this thread, I'm trying to HELP for god's sake. If people can't realize that and keep their negative comments to themselves, good luck and farewell, I've got better things to do that try and help the unappreciative.

[Khazul]

Not to disagree, but I think system startup and services should be left alone for this, especially services. Very easy to accidentally stop a service you think is not critical when it really is.


Yes - if I had to give my official customer and support friendly response - then I 100% agree with you :)

[Elektrobolt]

Re-installing the OS !!!!
Isn't that a bit like swatting a fly with a Buick ?
Instead, I suggest you all go out and buy a Mac, MUCH less problematic.

Yeah and have like 3 applications to choose from... ;)

[TOTAL]

Here is the list of issues that IMO will NOT be solved by BIOS update and system reinstall


- hanging notes in vc

- crazy screech, also when midi-connected to hardware (Roland Discover5)

- uneven arpeggio

- TI's hardware hangup and no response until replugging power



What COULD be solved is some glitches in VC mode.
I understand this would be then because of undisturbed USB1 flow.

For those even more laborious I have an information that it is not always the latest BIOS that it the most suitable. At motherboard forums people recommend also testing the older versions.

So, off you go ;)




DO WRITE IF SYSTEM REINSTALL HELPED YOUR TIs.


Within a week I will have an opportunity to test my TI on a freshly setup new DAW (4GB RAM, HD2496 zerolatencyasio soundcard, stuff dedicated to music and nuthing else). Very curious.


Hey, Tarekith, system reinstall preventatively? With no shit installed in the meantime? And with no issues?
It must be love :)

[Threlly]

Yeah and have like 3 applications to choose from... ;)

Nahh, Cubase, Ableton, DP, Logic, Tracktion and all the other less well known ones too.
I mean, PC users don't even have Logic anymore, or Digital Performer so thats at least one more than PC users......and I'm a PC user too.

[Tarekith]

Hey, Tarekith, system reinstall preventatively? With no shit installed in the meantime? And with no issues?
It must be love :)

Sorry, I must not have been clear. If I haven't installed anything since the last reinstall, then I don't do it.

[dr. orange]

every USB 1.1 device in the technic shop around the corner such as digicams, mp3 players etc work without problem. you don't have to reinstall the OS

[Tarekith]

None of those devices are steaming audio and midi in real time, I fail to see the comparison.

[dr. orange]

None of those devices are steaming audio and midi in real time, I fail to see the comparison.
no, but you can connect a digicam and watch the movie on your PC in realtime... and it is USB1.1 on the earlier models

[Tarekith]

IF you don't think it will help you out, fine, don't do it. The information is there for people who are looking for all options to try.

[dr. orange]

Tarekith, in your system, is VC being updated? I mean the patches and when you moove knobs on your hardware? Access doesn't want to reply to me somehow, probably they don't know any solution, maybe you know...
Audio is being sent from the TI to host via USB and MIDI is being sent from the host to hardware via USB as well, so the communication works in both ways, except patches and controllers. Do you think a USB card could solve my problem?

[Tarekith]

Yeah man, VC works fine for me. The only issues I really have still are the occasional stuck note and satan saw, no clicks, pops, or GUI issues. Very rare I see those too.

[grs]

Here is the list of issues that IMO will NOT be solved by BIOS update and system reinstall


- hanging notes in vc

- crazy screech, also when midi-connected to hardware (Roland Discover5)

- uneven arpeggio

- TI's hardware hangup and no response until replugging power




This is the same over 3 different xp computers in my studio. SP1, SP2, Laptops, Athlons, Intels what ever. I mean I recorded a 7 piece band the other day on my partners 1.8Ghz laptop with an RME fireface at 24bit 96khz. Like hardware that works is just cool. Amazing even. Some people forget that when you buy stuff it is supposed to work.

[TOTAL]

For those still having problems with their VSTI projects.

DON'T BE MISLEAD BY THE ARPS SEEMINGLY WORKING IN THE TUTORIAL SX SONG. Mind the choice of their patches - percussive, discreet ;) But the absolute hit for that matter is channel 5's "Dub Pad on Out 3+4" LOL!!

For reference solo just one arped channel, switch to this part in TI, and search for some other arpeggiated sound, preferably a lead type for a change. If now you notice that arp is out of sync at least you can be sure that the problem persists AND that it is not caused by maxing out the ti's DSProcessor. Listen for clicks and other artifacts. This is still the case with my TI.

What’s new in version 1.2.4?
Version 1.2.4 is a maintenance release. It resolves a problem
saving AU presets on Mac OS X, improves the startup
and introduces a component version number check.


What’s new in version 1.2.3?
Version 1.2.3. resolves startup and synchronisation issues, improves
the handling of 48k projects, offers faster starting up of
the Virus Control plug-in and other refinements.


What’s new in version 1.2.1?
Version 1.2.1 is a maintainance update to Version 1.2.1 with no
additional features. It fixes a MIDI timing related bug introduced
in version 1.2.0.


What’s new in version 1.2.0?
Direct monitoring
VU style level meters


What’s new in version 1.1?
Remote Mode



I can’t see any progress in stability or sync since 1.09 or so, when the Satan Saw was finally calmed down (reappears also in standalone, but very seldom and rather quiet)

No, cracks are less frequent in VC.

-dedicated USB card, no improvement BTW

[iwtbaavuser]

Hello,

When using virus control in Cubase sx 3.1.1.944, after a while, cubase returns a runtime error. It's a fresh XP sp2 system, audiophile 24/96, new usb cable, irq not shared.

szAppName : Cubasesx3.exe szAppVer : 3.1.1.944 szModName : hungapp
szModVer : 0.0.0.0 offset : 00000000

Did any of you received a runtime error?

[unifylight]

Hi im having trouble getting my virus ti to work in ableton 6 if someone could give me step by step instructions on how to install and hook up hw to a pc using ableton 6 this would be awesome.
cheers.
Steve

[Doc Jones]

Hi im having trouble getting my virus ti to work in ableton 6 if someone could give me step by step instructions on how to install and hook up hw to a pc using ableton 6 this would be awesome.
cheers.
Steve
Hey steve, welcome to the forum. what have you tried so far and what are the errors that you are getting?

[ptbena]

Hi there! Im new to the forum, just got a TI desktop and theres something which is freaking me out.
Thing is, when I load a MIDI in FL of an arped melody and I load VC and I make a patch consisting of>
Osc 1: Hypersaw; -12 semitones; Density 9.0; Detune 95; Key Follow: Norm.
Osc 2: Same settings as Osc 1.
Osc 3: Saw; -12 semitones; Detune 102; Volume 100
Unison: Mode: 8; Spread 127; Detune 127; LFO phase: 0

No SUB OSC, No Noise nor Ring modulator; OSC 1/2 Balance at 0

AMP: 0 attack; 0 decay; 127 sustain; 48 release
Filter; Lowpass analog mode 1; env amount 74; 0 attack; 35 decay; 0 sustain; 0 release.

NO FX AT ALL

When I start to play, it start making all sort of pops, clicks and crackles :S it also plays the melody kind of wrong as if some notes delay or play before, I cant realize well. Thing is, I dont know what it is, I discovered that when I turn unison off, all this trouble goes away, but I cant believe the TI cant handle this patch, Im running just this patch in VC and im using FL8. Does this happens to someone else cause im getting really scared that the Virus do this, I cant believe it cant handle 1 patch :(

[psy604]

Tarekith, in your system, is VC being updated? I mean the patches and when you moove knobs on your hardware? Access doesn't want to reply to me somehow, probably they don't know any solution, maybe you know...
Audio is being sent from the TI to host via USB and MIDI is being sent from the host to hardware via USB as well, so the communication works in both ways, except patches and controllers. Do you think a USB card could solve my problem?

happened here once, reinstalling the Virus driver should solve the issue.

... think that may come from changing the USB port, which the Virus is/was connected to.

[Pugface]

My TI and cubase studio 4.5.2 are happy bunnies together other than known os3 issues.

i would recommend to not use the TI as your main audio card, its poor anyway

get rid of any undesired services and stop firewalls and virus programs running while in audio use. including any sevices running in the background they may have started. AVG leaves a service going even though you exit it.

Here is the world's best tune up site...

http://www.blackviper.com/

make sure you have the usb power saver set to disabled in the registry. The install does it for you on request. but make sure its "1".

also midi issues with time stamping in windows xp can be solved with this micrsoft update. where some pcs suffer from clock sync issues. especially laptops.

use the microsoft update kb896256

to enable

PerfEnablePackageIdle

at

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/896256 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/896256)

This update apparently straightens the use of your TSC clock in timestamps.

Quote from microsoft..........

"Correct TSC synchronization
On some operating systems, the processor TSC may change the rate at which it counts. Additionally, the processor TSC may stop counting when specific processor power management features are used. On computers that have multiple processors, the TSC is typically the operating system hardware timer that supports calls to the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function. When TSC does not increment monotonically, system components that use the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function may not work correctly. To address this problem, Microsoft makes it possible for the ACPI Power Management Timer to be used as the operating system timer that supports the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function. However, some programs may directly access the TSC by bypassing the Windows timer APIs. The multiple-processor Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) makes sure that the TSC registers on all processors on a multiple-processor computer remain closely synchronized. Therefore, access by system software that may be directed to different processors does not return different results. This change makes sure that the multiple-processor HAL continues to correctly synchronize the TSCs across all processors on a computer, even if the ACPI power management timer is used as the operating system hardware timer. "


what i really find is a good audio pc is a good virus TI.

watch your cpu isn't spiking if that is happening there is something wrong.

you might have a faulty cpu too!

in normal pc use you wouldn't notice a faulty core as the mfr's don't care about us musi's. also you could have faulty Ram Too! don't assume that because your pc is happy in normal use that it meets audio specs. your cpu could be overheating and that cause spikes.

[Pugface]

also turn down the brightness levels on your TI. it works better when flat out!

[grs]

....
also midi issues with time stamping in windows xp can be solved with this micrsoft update. where some pcs suffer from clock sync issues. especially laptops.

use the microsoft update kb896256

to enable

PerfEnablePackageIdle

at

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/896256 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/896256)

This update apparently straightens the use of your TSC clock in timestamps.

Quote from microsoft..........

"Correct TSC synchronization
On some operating systems, the processor TSC may change the rate at which it counts. Additionally, the processor TSC may stop counting when specific processor power management features are used. On computers that have multiple processors, the TSC is typically the operating system hardware timer that supports calls to the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function. When TSC does not increment monotonically, system components that use the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function may not work correctly. To address this problem, Microsoft makes it possible for the ACPI Power Management Timer to be used as the operating system timer that supports the kernel KeQueryPerformanceCounter function. However, some programs may directly access the TSC by bypassing the Windows timer APIs. The multiple-processor Hardware Abstraction Layer (HAL) makes sure that the TSC registers on all processors on a multiple-processor computer remain closely synchronized. Therefore, access by system software that may be directed to different processors does not return different results. This change makes sure that the multiple-processor HAL continues to correctly synchronize the TSCs across all processors on a computer, even if the ACPI power management timer is used as the operating system hardware timer. "

...


Just managed to save myself hours of manual wave capture and hand quantising stuff..
Had the usual 3 to 5 millisecond drift but the bad arp timing and the usb clicks are gone.
I've tested it for a week now with several old mixes known to have bad arp drift and clicks. All gone.
The thing for me is why my windows auto update didn't ever include this..?? Mad! Such a crucial fix.

[Hecticcc]

@ Pugface: Thank a ton for finding a fix. I have just managed to get my TI2 synced up using the virus ti plugin with this xp update :D

[Littlenegrilio]

Lol you people still use PC's when it comes to using an actual sequencer? Hey, it's the year 2010. Mac is the way to Go! No excuses! No viruses, no BS! In logic pro, my virus works perfectly! And I don't need to reinstall a whole operating system.

[MBTC]

Lol you people still use PC's when it comes to using an actual sequencer? Hey, it's the year 2010. Mac is the way to Go! No excuses! No viruses, no BS! In logic pro, my virus works perfectly! And I don't need to reinstall a whole operating system.

Heh.. where've you been? Viruses/malware haven't been a real issue on any recent version of Windows in a long time. Mac's day of security reckoning is still to come (http://www.dailytech.com/Another+Major+Mac+Computer+Security+Flaw+Discovered/article15832.htm). Honestly I wouldn't mind to have one of the things, just as another toy. The long-term security issue Apple products are going to need to face (sooner or later) is a concern, but inevitable. The real issue is the cost. To have a Mac that is anywhere near as powerful as my current PC, I would have to spend close to $8,000 US last time I checked. With the current crop of high-end CPUs, you might find the need for hardware synths like the Virus to be on the decline. Now in terms of interoperability (especially with music hardware and the like), this is where Apple would seem to have an advantage, so I can believe it would be easier to get VC working well in Logic (reduced QA burden). Whether or not that advantage is worth the rediculous price tag and overall value (aka Apple Tax) for the dollar is another story.

Some of the soft synths that I rely on, and produce as good or better results than the Virus Ti2 are not even available on Mac platform.

[feedingear]

Apple so heavily over rated - and I strongly disagree with the way they sell products with limited functionality - iPods where you cant take your files off the ipod onto a computer for one example. Not to mention the ridiculous costs for less powerful hardware. I produce on Win XP and I have 0 issues - Cubase will crash time to time usually from CPU overloading, but the OS itself is perfectly stable.

[synthfiend]

Lol you people still use PC's when it comes to using an actual sequencer? Hey, it's the year 2010. Mac is the way to Go! No excuses! No viruses, no BS! In logic pro, my virus works perfectly! And I don't need to reinstall a whole operating system.

I would have to agree, its not that my PC and Ableton did'nt work fine with VC but the Mac Mini has far less latency for whatever reason.

[Littlenegrilio]

Man, you have it all on MAC right now. What kind of synths are you looking for. I maybe can help you.

[Littlenegrilio]

Apple so heavily over rated - and I strongly disagree with the way they sell products with limited functionality - iPods where you cant take your files off the ipod onto a computer for one example. Not to mention the ridiculous costs for less powerful hardware. I produce on Win XP and I have 0 issues - Cubase will crash time to time usually from CPU overloading, but the OS itself is perfectly stable.
What? Mac are expensive? LOL. Get on craiglist and you will have people in your home town selling macs for nothing! I found mines for 900 bucks! A Mac Pro g5 then I added 12gigs of ram for $250. Works flawless! It almost NEVER crashes! Ever!

[MBTC]

Man, you have it all on MAC right now. What kind of synths are you looking for. I maybe can help you.

Oresus has become an important synth in my arsenal and is not currently available on Mac. I was using Sylenth1 for probably a year before they finally came out with a Mac version. For a lot of synth makers, the Mac version is an afterthought.