Virus Ti Snow + Ableton 7 problem

[slowblow]

Hi Everyone, im new on the forum so I want to say hello first.
I have a serious problem [for me]. I`m using Macbook Pro [since one month, early PC] with Leopard with latest udpdates and my daw is Ableton Live 7.0.10. The main problem is when I`m dropping Virus Snow as Ti or Au to new track then Ableton crashes. I have checked all parameters, Virus Control Center is not responding, and Virus Ti Settings says "Virus Ti is not connected". I`ve updated Snow to latest beta version also I`ve tried with earliest versions. Still no idea what is going on..
anyone can help me ?

p.s- I`ve checked Snow on PC and it`s working perfectly..

[psy604]

sounds like some communication problem.
maybe once try to disconnect all USB devices but the virus.
and it has to be plugged into the same port as it was installed with.

question: are you using any USB audio interface?

[slowblow]

No, Virus Ti Snow now is the only one.. but its working as audio interface on Ableton.

[thelike5]

Make sure you are using a native port on the actual Macbook. That's essential.

After that try and update to the latest OS, which was released last week.

Then, be sure to properly set buffer to 256 in audio preferences in Ableton.

Please also be sure you are using the VSTi version of the Snow plug-in... not the AU version.

Let us know how things are going.

[slowblow]

Buffer now is in 256 samples, Vsti crashes Ableton..
so reaction is still the same :(

[Doc Jones]

I believe there is a way to pass debug parameters to the app when launching to get Live to run in debug mode. this will create a crash log that will tell you exactly what is going on with the app right up to the point where it crashes. I would definitely contact Ableton with this.

[psy604]

trying to log the crash is a good idea ... else it's only a guessing around.
the log will show definitely, but systematic narrowing down the problem can help, too.

my recommendation would be to try most simple setup:
with macbook audio instead of virus audio interface.

[slowblow]

by the way how can i reset settings on Virus Snow ?
There is no "arp edit" button ? :)

[psy604]

think it should be the <TAP TEMPO> button insteed.

[slowblow]

It`s me again.. I think the problem is too big now. I wrote to Access Support, they wrote me to reset Snow and connect again..
but reaction is the same... I wrote 3rd time and still no answer..
After checking new OS, Virus still working as audio interface only.
Anyone have sugestions ?
I`m discouraged :(

[leszczu]

Yep, I have same problem like you with my macbook and virus ti kb. Solution? I install Win XP Pro sp3 in Bootcamp and everything works perfect... I know there's something wrong with usb ports under leopard. Its not straight usb from controller. It's hub... I try uninstall isight camera and ir from one port but fuc*** leopardo still see connected devices to hub. In this weekend I will try install Tiger and see what wil happend.
Cheers

[psy604]

you could use a PCMCIA USB-Controller in order to have 2/4 native ports available ...
a different version of MAC OS won't change the hardware configuration of the ports, i guess ;)

something like this: here (http://www.usb-ware.com/usb-2-pcmcia-card-4-port-ub504.htm) (you just have to be sure, that there's drivers for MAC)
(http://www.usb-ware.com/usb-2-pcmcia-card-4-port-ub504.htm)

[leszczu]

MacBook don't have PCIMCIA. :) Maybe some adapter on FireWire? Maybe. :) For me it's temporary situation because now I upgrading my PC and I need to survive. ;)
Cheers.

[psy604]

it got no PCMCIA?! just can't understand all that MAC hype ... if it not even got the most basic industry standard expansion slot.

you could modify it by soldering in 4 wires (just before the internal hub) to gain access to a native USB port (without any warranty).

this firewire-2-USB adapters are mainly designed for connecting DV equipment to an USB 2.0 port (there's PAL & NTSC versions).

only thing i could imagine would be some firewire audio-interface with MIDI I/O ... but you couldn't use the TI feature this way.

[slowblow]

Leszczu ? any news about Tiger ?
I checked on usb express card, the same result.. :(

[leszczu]

I was like a Tiger during this weekend... :) Now I have little hangover.
Cheers

[slowblow]

SO..
There is a solution but I think...
I`m using macbook with Polish version of Leopard, and I just change the region and main language to English and Snow now works perfectly...
:O
there is a god on this planet :) tommorow I will have a hangover.
Thanks for any help.. cheers

[leszczu]

No co ty pitolisz? I dziala? zaraz sprawdze. :)

[Dogus]

i have the same problem...but switching languages didnt help at all...same problem with both ableton and logic...also cannot open the virus control center...dont know what to do...by the way i tried it on tiger - not working, leopard = not working...windows xp = it works..:(

[psy604]

it seems, that XP sees the USB ports different than macOS ...
if you can make it understand, that there's no hub present, this would be solution.

http://www.macuser.com/images/2008/05/skitched-20080509-115108.jpg

MacBook:
http://blog.wired.com/gadgets/mac-usb.jpg
disabling the built-in iSight cam could free up bandwidth from the v2.0 bus.
just a bit unsure, if the other buses are v1.0 or v1.1 ... Virus TI requires v1.1.

MacBook Air:
http://www.maushammer.com/systems/mba/USB_files/droppedImage.jpg

... an interesting technical article about macBook Air:
http://www.maushammer.com/systems/mba/USB.html
(http://www.maushammer.com/systems/mba/USB.html)(this guy had the same thought as me: soldering in 4 wires)
(http://www.maushammer.com/systems/mba/USB.html)

[thelike5]

it got no PCMCIA?! just can't understand all that MAC hype ... if it not even got the most basic industry standard expansion slot.

you could modify it by soldering in 4 wires (just before the internal hub) to gain access to a native USB port (without any warranty).

this firewire-2-USB adapters are mainly designed for connecting DV equipment to an USB 2.0 port (there's PAL & NTSC versions).

only thing i could imagine would be some firewire audio-interface with MIDI I/O ... but you couldn't use the TI feature this way.

Maybe the PCMCIA card was the most basic industry standard expansion slot in 1996 but last I checked that was three Presidency terms away and an awful lot has changed. Back then, we didn't even use USB as a connection protocal for any type of midi controller, let alone full fledged synthesizers/hardware inside a sequencing program.

I have a macbook (Core Duo 2 1.87 ghz, 2 gigs of ram) and a Snow and have had zero connectivity issues after about 1 day of figuring out the device.

You need to use one of the two macbooks native USB ports. Update to the latest OS (2.7.3) immediatly. Make sure you have the USB cable connected when you go to update. You do not need to have Ableton Live booted up (nor the Snow plugged in yet). Download directly from the Access site. Once the update has downloaded save it to your desktop. THEN, plug in the Snow via USB to one of those aforementioned native ports and double click the update installer. The update should begin (look at the Snow display and you should see (update in progress.)

Once this is complete restart the macbook. Boot up Ableton Live 7. Select the Snow VSTI under VST plug ins and then wait for it to intialize. This should do it. If the unit won't work it may be a defective Snow.

I'd have to consider that an option.

[thelike5]

Here's how I setup...

No USB Hub with the Snow. It won't work. You need to use native USB ports.

I had an ok USB soundcard which I had to ditch in favor of a firewire card seeign that between my controller (Remote 25 which also requires native power) and my Snow I was out of ports.

Here's how I'm setup...

Macbook 1.87 ghz two gigs of ram

Ableton Live 7

Accesss Virus Snow (latest OS)

Novation Remote 25 Compact SL (I think I may still have beta software! Need to upgrade)

Mackie Onyx satellite soundcard

KRK monitors

Both the Novation controller and Access Snow are plugged directly into the macbook via USB. The Snow requires its own external power source (sadly) so that adaptor is plugged in too. The Mackie satellite is in via firewire. (At this point I am out of native USB and firewire ports.) KRK monitors are hooked in directly to the Mackies outs on the back side.

Once I power my system on, I turn my midi controller on and it lights up and is all set and ready to go. After, I cursor over to the left (where my dock is) and select Ableton Live 7. Once that boots up I go into Lives preferences and select "output source" as Mackie Satellite Onyx. This disables the macbooks crappy internal speakers and I have my decent KRK's as my main output. At this point auto map "automaps" the settings of Live 7 to the best of its abilites to the actual lcd of the Novation controller. Select any audio loop into a audio track and drop in a "filter vst effect" from Live. The Novation controller will change its settings and you can tweak knobs in real time and the filer goes from high to low pass. Sweep to your hearts desire.

From there, I go over to VST Instruments tab to the left of the Live 7 GUI. I select Snow Ti VST from the drop down and the Snow automatically appears in a midi track to the right of all of my audio tracks. (Make sure the Snow is powered up and not sleeping first!) The Snow then "initializes" and you will start off with the INIT pattern. From there, go into the browser of the Virus Control and select which ever patch you desire. The name of the patch magically jumps fromt he browser of the Virus Control onto the lovely Snow display. Play a chord on your midi controller and hear those luch Access Pads.

My problems with the Snow came about when I de-selected the Snow from its midi track. I could not re-start or re-selct the Snow without it freezing up halfway through the "initializing" screen. I would have to power off (not just reset) my macbook and redo every single step i mentioned above. i also experienced frequent hung or stuck feedback inducing midi notes which in itself would ruin a live set entirely. I could never just quit the Snow and restart it without having to power down.

The new OS fixes all of this. This setup is strictly for using the Access Virus Snow in ti mode within a software host. I purchased an external power supply for my Novation Controller which allows me to use my Snow in multi mode! Really cool way to work. I'm hoping a future update allows the following:

Use of Snow in multi-mode within a software host (like Live 7)

Snow able to be powered directly via usb. No need for the external power supply. (I doubt that will happen though...)

That's about it. I love my Snow!!

[psy604]

Maybe the PCMCIA card was the most basic industry standard expansion slot in 1996 ...

i still have an low latency PCMCIA audio interface (Echo Indigo I/O), which supports bus mastering.
PCMCIA is like PCI for portable computers and it's still actual (other eg: RME Hammerfall).

on USB or FW you will never get this low latency, since there's no direct access to the bus - and when i look at the USB architecture of the macBooks,
i can see clearly that there is no unshared port available ... nowaday PC notebooks all have 2-3 native (unshared) USB v2.0 ports
( ... and macBook Air even has unused buses without any connector) ;)

[Dogus]

It has been a week and no reply from access music support...
I dont know about the usb ports in Mac Pro..but my virus ti snow doesnt work in mac pro, macbook pro..works in windows tho. Tried 5 ports in Mac pro...and 2 in macbook pro...
I dont know what to do...just give this thing back i guess :(((

[psy604]

Dogus: you should consider to have a local tech-support guy to have a look at the problem ...
with some experience with data interconnects it's not that hard to establish the connection.
you should negotiate a support-deal *on success* - NOT *per hour* ;)

PS: this "All About MAC" utility could be useful for the debug.

[Dogus]

The main problem is i can see the snow in the usb section of mac...mac sees it in a way :( just cant open control center and crashes every squancer i used with it. but as a soundcard its ok. :/

[thelike5]

The main problem is i can see the snow in the usb section of mac...mac sees it in a way :( just cant open control center and crashes every squancer i used with it. but as a soundcard its ok. :/

Are you able to update the Snow via usb? Don't even open Ableton. Download the latest OS from Access and then follow the directions I posted above. Start with the Snow. If you can update it just fine you know its not the Snow. I can't see why you are having the troubles you are. I'd love to help you out in person, for free, but I'm in Cleveland and I doubt you are...

[psy604]

have you ever tried to use another USB cable?

there's USB v2.0 cables, shielded with a ferrit bead on one of it's ends.
this shielding prevents interferences while data transfers in progress.

[Dogus]

yea i can update it via usb...and also tried 3 different usb cables...i have a problem with both of my macs i guess..i have a macbook pro and a mac pro..one with tiger the other with leopard. Snow doesnt working with any of them. just wierd and no replies from access music :(
Thelike5 thanks anyway..im from Turkey..just other side of the world :)

[psy604]

did you just try any different USB cables, or a shielded one???
it's looking like this here (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/Cable_end.JPG) (... of course with another jack).

even when you can update it via USB, if doesn't necessarily mean the cable is just fine.
(firmware update is no high-speed transfer / when it's playing you have 3 audio streams plus MIDI I/O).

... this is why i really think: it has to be the cable.

[Dogus]

yea..tried shielded cable also...
a reply came from access music support..they also asked me if i tried any other usb cable...i told them that i tried everything. They think that there must a problem about macbook pro and mac pro both. It can be in a way..becouse i set up mac pro from macbook pro via firewire.

[psy604]

well ... if you really think it's the OS: then i'd recommend a clean install.

[altunamusic]

did you just try any different USB cables, or a shielded one???
it's looking like this here (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/73/Cable_end.JPG) (... of course with another jack).

even when you can update it via USB, if doesn't necessarily mean the cable is just fine.
(firmware update is no high-speed transfer / when it's playing you have 3 audio streams plus MIDI I/O).

... this is why i really think: it has to be the cable.

Hi mate, i got a huge latency too in Live 7.0.15.. and i went to looking for the special USB you recommend... may i know what kind of USB is that?

Thanks :o

[ehunter]

Any updates on this...I am also running ableton 7 on a MBP and installed OS3 with my snow...it works for a bit but eventually;y when I try switching banks it crashes

[Splat!]

I'm running Live 7.0.12 and 8.0.1 with OS3.0.06. Everything seems to be working fine ;)
Haven't tried any of the new OS' since this ones steady.:cool:
________
Dodge B Series specifications (http://www.dodge-wiki.com/wiki/Dodge_B_Series)

[ehunter]

I'm running Live 7.0.12 and 8.0.1 with OS3.0.06. Everything seems to be working fine ;)
Haven't tried any of the new OS' since this ones steady.:cool:


I put 2.7.5 on and its working now, guess OS 3 is not working well with live 7 for me