Need help using all of the Virus's 16 parts in logic

[Arty]

hello people :)

I am a dance music producer and I am running into a problem I can't solve myself.

What I'm trying to do is to use all 16 parts of my virus TI and that each part has its own mixer channel. I have an M-audio firewire Profire 610 Audio interface but I don't know how it will help me with the goal im trying to reach. All the help I need i can find here and I'll appreciate all who are able to get me through.

PS: I use logic Studio 8

[boborulz]

You won't have much luck running all 16 parts at the same time...the computer and virus wont handle it. I can get 4 (5 if im lucky) max. in the common page in the VC you can direct parts to 3 separate usb channels and 3 separate analogue outs, thats all.

[Arty]

I also have an audio interface with me. Can using the virus through that increase the number of channels I can use?

[izimizam]

i would say no , the bottom line is you will need a moiracle from god to run 16 parts without glitches , pops , clicks and 'dropouts' , its much better to work with less and maybe maximise the ' minimalism ' aspect of music making.


I also have an audio interface with me. Can using the virus through that increase the number of channels I can use?

[Roby31]

Even if the virus did work with 16 parts you only would have 3 stereo analog outs, 3 stereo usb outs and 1 stereo spdif out this would lead you to 7 different channels or 14 different PANNED mono channels

[Alakhai]

if you need more Virus tracks than your synth&pc can handle, you can always record some tracks to audio files and use elsewhere the synth's sound engine ;)

[Arty]

Even if the virus did work with 16 parts you only would have 3 stereo analog outs, 3 stereo usb outs and 1 stereo spdif out this would lead you to 7 different channels or 14 different PANNED mono channels

Ah, okay. The main thing im asking is, how do i set up my virus with an audio interface so I can have each part (as many as I can use) have its own mixer channel in logic?

[feedingear]

You can assign outputs on the virus to individual parts, but you are limited to the amount of physical outputs on the virus.

"3 stereo analog outs, 3 stereo usb outs and 1 stereo spdif out this would lead you to 7 different channels or 14 different PANNED mono channels"

[Arty]

Well im tyring to set everything up but its so hard in logic to do what i want to. I have to use all these busses and whatnot and its so confusing.

[Arty]

I create 16 auxillaries but Im not seeing any options to put the TI in them. This is from running it with just USB. Can anyone really help me here.

[feedingear]

Have you tried reading the Logic Tutorials that are under your Virus TI install folder in the start bar...?

[boborulz]

setup one instrument track. then 16 midi tacks. in each midi track select the virus ti as the input. then for each respective track you should be able to select 1-16 different midi channels for each of the 16 midi channels. there should be a logic tutorial in the virus documentation.

[Arty]

That Method doesn't work in logic. I can't give the MIDI channels an input. Just groups. Also the tutorial doesn't do anything.

[WakeOfDestruction]

You need to setup a multitimbral instrument in logic


Select new track... click on the New Software Instrument and make sure to check the multitimbral option and set at 16... logic will open 16 channels with each one assigned to a different MIDI channel. Choose Virus TI multi-output AU as the audio in and it should work normal.

[Arty]

Mmmm lets see..

Im using an M-Audio Profire 610 Audio interface. On the Back there are two regular inputs and in the front two XLR mic inputs. On both outputs 1 and 2 with jsut the left channel only, I have them both going into the inputs on the back. I also have both the in and out SPDIF going from the virus to the SPDIF of the audio interface. How to I get logic to read them?

[Arty]

Mmmm lets see..

Im using an M-Audio Profire 610 Audio interface. On the Back there are two regular inputs and in the front two XLR mic inputs. On both outputs 1 and 2 with jsut the left channel only, I have them both going into the inputs on the back. I also have both the in and out SPDIF going from the virus to the SPDIF of the audio interface. How to I get logic to read them?

[Tinman]

Not sure if this is any help to u and im sure there is a better way but this is how i have my virus set up in logic 8

I have the TI loaded in as a multi channel instrument.
Then in the enviroment (mixer window) on the channel with the virus loaded click the little + button in the bottom right of that channel below the mute and solo buttons. This then duplicates the instrument channel with the virus loaded in to it.

Name the duplicate channel virus 2 or something
Then on that duplicate channel got to the inspector on the left hand side of the enviroment
You need to change the midi channel value from 1 to 2 and so on for as many parts as u want, remembering to change the midi channel value to match. 1, 2, 3 etc
If you repeat these steps for as many channels as you want u can then play multiple parts from the virus.

However there is a problem with this method. And that is because you are basically duplicating the same instrument channel and just changing the midi channel value it means that if you say wanted to adjust the pan or volume or even add a effect to 1 part through logic it duplicate the changes to all.

I.E if i insert a compressor to a sound it inserts that same compressor across all channels i have duplicated. Hence there is a better way of setting it up but i aint got round to looking it up yet. My friend has some instructions apparently but i have not had time to see him about them yet. For now tho i get round it by using the mixer in the virus or bouncing a sound down if i want to add more extreme fx's or plugins to a sound.

P.S I only have my virus connected through USB too. Again im not sure if this is correct.....i am mearly a learner. Im sure others with more knowledge would be of greater help to you. Maybe even give me some advise on better setting up and running of my TI. :-)

thanks

[Arty]

Ah I am trying to get over this obstacle too.

[Arty]

One problem I have is that when I try to look for outputs to put into auxillaries, the virus's outs (USB) don't even show up. I have it in multimode (VC).

[Arty]

Well looks like its time I dusted off the virus and Im still tackling this problem. What Audio Interfaces do you guys use when having the virus with Multi Outs?

[maelstrom808]

From reading your previous posts in this thread, it sounds like you are trying to set up 16 individual audio input channels, one for each part for the Virus, which is simply not possible. You max out at 6 possible output channels in mono or 3 in stereo. This means if you are going to use more than 6 parts a time, some are going to have to share outputs. Any FX plugins you apply on a given channel will affect everything that is being piped through that channel. There is no way around this as it's a limitation of the hardware (although 6 seperate outputs is still pretty generous on a synth)

Now you can set up a MIDI channel for each part, but of course this pretty much only gives you volume and panning control for each part.

You can record a part in and apply FX to the recorded audio, but you simply cannot run 16 live parts each with a dedicated input.

[Arty]

Seeing in many other replies to my question that its the hardware that limits me to this. Whats the best audio interface to use the maximum number of outs the virus can give me (that being six). I know usb will give me...3 right?

[GV1UK]

I really don't understand why you need 16 outs. Most of my songs have around 8 tracks max (not including drums) and sound great.

Just use the 3 outputs. If you need more sounds from your virus record the audio into logic and you'll have another 3 channels to use.

It sounds like your trying to push the impossible.

Your interface is fine. Simply run your outputs into a mixer and the mixer into the interface. Job done.

[feedingear]

Not sure why you dont just bounce them down individually, or use the mixing within the TI plugin to control levels before you do your mix... once your ready to start fine tuning the sounds with your VST effectsor other outboard gear, then bounce as audio.

I use a stack of tracks, and I know that a lot of producers can easily use 2-300 channels for a dnb track (Shock One for example) once you add all the breaks, one shots, and synth fx samples.

[Arty]

I really don't understand why you need 16 outs. Most of my songs have around 8 tracks max (not including drums) and sound great.

Just use the 3 outputs. If you need more sounds from your virus record the audio into logic and you'll have another 3 channels to use.

It sounds like your trying to push the impossible.

Your interface is fine. Simply run your outputs into a mixer and the mixer into the interface. Job done.

I always thought that a mixer would help alot with the interface but I don't understand inputs and outputs. The virus has 4 stereo outout puts but on the back or top of mixers, I only see one line in. On my M-audio audio interface I only have 8 OUTPUTS and two inputs? That doesn't make sense at all.

[Arty]

Not sure why you dont just bounce them down individually, or use the mixing within the TI plugin to control levels before you do your mix... once your ready to start fine tuning the sounds with your VST effectsor other outboard gear, then bounce as audio.

I use a stack of tracks, and I know that a lot of producers can easily use 2-300 channels for a dnb track (Shock One for example) once you add all the breaks, one shots, and synth fx samples.

Well the problem with using outboard effects with the TI is that all the parts are coming out through one mixer output so any effect I put on it will globally affect the all the parts. Bouncing to audio will limit me because I wouldn't know if any part needs to be automated prior to bouncing if I wanted to free up the virus for more use.

[MBTC]

Just my thoughts, I think of bouncing down tracks as a technique that was acceptable in the days of older, more limited mixers (for most people's budget), so I think of it as sort of a last resort technique these days. It's too limiting to workflow, in my personal opinion.

The only reason I can think of for only 3 stereo USB outs on the TI is once again the USB 1.1 limitation. I just hope the next gen Virus opens that bottleneck up.

[feedingear]

Keep the midi files and automation always.. if you need to edit it or are unhappy with the pass, just go back and do so. But I've said that 100 times already in this and other threads. I bounce a lot of my vst tracks down anyway not only to save cpu, as well as use fx and cut up and edit the waveforms.

[MBTC]

That's true, there are other reasons for doing it other than just overcoming the usb out limit, sometimes I will chop up a waveform just to get a gating effect across multiple instruments. But I guess when I'm doing it as part of the creative process instead of as a limitation workaround, it feels less cumbersome?
I'm not a particularly good producer -- if I were, I would have a clear goal in mind and be able (and have the patience) to do what you said, but since I do it only for enjoyment, anything practical or that requires organization is too likely to feel like work :).
Maybe one day I will intentionally start bouncing things down so that I reach for it as a second nature activity, to help remove that pain I have with it.

For the record though, I still think 3 stereo outs needs improvement on a synth costing as the TI2 does.

[GV1UK]

For the record though, I still think 3 stereo outs needs improvement on a synth costing as the TI2 does.

I'm not familiar with the virus (until I get mine ... tomorrow). But 3 outputs is 2 more than my Korg Radias. I paid a lot for my Radias and that thing only has 4 timbres and 1 stero output.

I think 3 outputs are enough if you mix the audio on the virus and use the 3 outputs to send the mixes audio through. When your ready to mix down just bounce the audio accross as seperate channels.

I also dislike/strangely enjoy the boucing, re-edit, re-bounce process. I own an MPC 2500, Korg EMX and Korg Radias. I am forever bouncing audio through. But I do feel this limitiation actually helps the creative process and forces you to become a better player at whatever instrument you play.

Just think, a lot of bands that use live instruments have to retake whole tracks when they mess up. It's no issue for those guys because it's second nature.

I no longer really see it as effort, although I dislike it, I have learnt to be quick at it. I have a USB mixer so recording in is very easy, painless and great quality.

[MBTC]

It might greatly depend on what style of music you make, but for my workflow there isn't really a good analogy between a band doing multiple takes and me doing bouncing down in a DAW. The main difference for me lies in the automation -- for example if I have 5-6 instruments playing at once, of course the melodies in my genre come first, but closely behind that in priority is automation. Once I bounce it to a waveform there is not much I can do with the synth instruments in terms of automation. I can of course manipulate volume, the cutoff etc for the entire track, and add FX but by that time each instrument is closely married to each other, and I can't for example add a delay to only one instrument out of those six, which might be actually two mixer tracks combined into one (representing 12 instruments in this example). So instead of being able to do some automation with delay or chorus or a synth control like phase or morphing against one of those instruments just to change it up a bit, I can only do it against 12 instruments at a time and I must use mixer effects rather than synth controls.

Does that mean the music will sound worse? Definately not, in my case actually the less I screw around with the better off I am :) How good the music is ultimately has very little to do with what's available as much as what you do with it and what you're willing to accept as the final take. But, when I cannot modifiy the individual components of the track it feels so limiting to the creative process... it's purely a mental thing, I know... but I just wanted to make clear it wasn't so much an issue of laziness on my part, it doesn't take that much effort. Its just if I want to reap the benefit, I'm going to have to come up with a final take on a track early in the creation process, or be willing to keep revisiting it later.

[GV1UK]

@MBTC

Yeah I will agree with you there. As I said I don't own the virus (well I do now, but when I posted I didn't).

Automation on this baby will be a MUST!

I freakin love the way the plugin integrates with Logic. Sorry I'm getting excited again :p