Novation BASS STATION 2 KEYBOARD!!!

[namnibor]

http://us.novationmusic.com/hardware-synths/bass-station-ii/system-requirements

No prices yet! Returned from the dentist to find this email from Novation announcing their 21st anniversary and this surely will be at Frankfurt next week and I am excited!! The specs are pretty good and only think I do not see is a CV out but:

Specifications


<a class="addthis_counter addthis_pill_style" style="display: inline-block;" href="http://us.novationmusic.com/hardware-synths/bass-station-ii/specifications#">




Synth engine

Oscillators


Osc 1
Osc 2
Sub Osc (3)
Noise generator
Osc 1 & 2
Select between waveforms:

sine
triangle
sawtooth
square/variable pulse widthFeatures

Sync 1 & 2
Detune
Octave range
Pitch bend
Pitch modulation to Mod Envelope and LFO 1
Pulse width modulation to Mod Envelope and LFO 2Sub Osc (3) which is tracked to Osc 1
Select independently between waveforms:

Sine
Square
Narrow pulseFeatures

All modulation and tuning tracked to Osc 1
Independent octave selectMixer


Osc 1 level
Osc 2 level
Sub Osc level
Noise generator level
Ring modulation depth
External signal levelFilter

Two filter types

Acid type (diode ladder filter design)
Classic type (derived from original Bass Station)Features

Cutoff
Resonance
Overdrive
Filter frequency to Mod Envelope depth
Filter frequency to LFO 2 depthSelect 'Classic' filter between:

Low pass
Band pass
High pass
12dB slope
24dB slopeEnvelopes

Two ADSR Envelopes (Attack/Decay/Sustain/Release)

Amp Envelope
Mod Envelope
Combined control of both EnvelopesSelect triggering mode between:

Single trigger (holds envelope state when new note is played)
Multi trigger (re-triggers with every new note played)
Autoglide (engages portamento)There is also a VCA limiter
LFO

Two LFOs each selectable between:

Triangle
Sawtooth
Square
Sample and hold
Both LFOs independently adjustable between rate and delay time
Key sync LFO 1 & 2
LFO slew on LFO 1& 2 (low pass filter on the LFO waveform) Effects


Distortion send
Oscillator filter mod amount (FM effect created by Oscillator 2 modulating filter freq)Step Sequencer/Arpeggiator

Arpeggiator

Up to 32 different patterns
Select between 1-4 octave range
Swing function
Select direction:
up
down
up / down 1
up / down 2
As played
Random
Latch (hold the arpeggiator)Step Sequencer

Up to four sequences
Assign one of 32 preset rhythms or create your own
insert rests or legato (slide)
Sequencer re-trigger functionPortamento


Adjust glide time
Single trigger or re-trigger modes
Integrate into step sequencer and arpeggiatorHardware & controller assignment


25 note synth-action keyboard
Aftertouch can be assigned to modulate:
Filter frequency
LFO 1to Osc pitch
Osc 2 speed
Pitch wheel
Modulation wheel can be assigned to:
LFO 2 to filter frequency
LFO 1 to Osc pitch
Osc 2 pitch
Octave up/ down buttons
64 factory presets
64 slots for user patches (and patch dump facility for storing more)
Master volume dialInputs and Outputs


USB MIDI (for connecting & powering Bass Station II via host computer)
Mono outputs on 1/4" TRS jack
Headphone output on 1/4" TRS jack
External input on 1/4" TRS jack
Sustain pedal input on 1/4" TRS jack
MIDI IN / MIDI OUT ports on 5 pin din
AC power input
Switch between power off / AC powered / bus poweredSWEET~! The analog revolution makes me sh-h-h-iver with antici........pation! (a bit of "Rocky Horror Picture Show" relapse reference there):D

[namnibor]

A cool video from Novation!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=utKZJdaNLyE&utm_campaign=Bass%20Station%20II&utm_content=103899946942&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Emailvision

I still have my Novation Supernova 1 Rack because it simply is a very capable machine and the poly programmable Arp is out of this world!

I happen to be shopping in next few months to decide on a dedicated analog monosynth or otherwise and contenders are: Korg MS-20 Mini, Waldorf Pulse 2 (if and when released and hoping Frankfurt will be launch), and now Novation Bass Station 2.
Already have DSI Mono Evolver Keyboard with two desktop Evolvers poly chained and am not interested in the other DSI analogs because somehow, the two analog osc's on Evolver are way more organic with many artifacts that make it far from "sterile", and can isolate those with push of two buttons on the Mono Evolver keyboard's excellent interface.
Yet, still want a small footprint dedicated analog and the Moog Minotaur Bass Synth is very much a one trick pony IMHO.

[TweakHead]

I think the Mini Brute is also one to consider: specially because of it's flexible multi-mode filter. Still a rare thing on this simple Mono Analogues, to have a resonant (self-oscillating) high-pass filter, like the Korg and the Brute. Still waiting to see how this lader filter (acid filter) will sound on the Novation. They used to sound very good for teebee sounds, the original, for those of you into acid stuff.

This thing being Novation, and if the first Bass Station is a good indication to have in mind, will be priced fairly cheap and sound very good. Interface looks decent!

http://d19ulaff0trnck.cloudfront.net/sites/default/files/novationmusic/products/Bass-Station-II/BSII-Banner.jpg

EDIT

I didn't even consider the Waldorf, since this is like a myth synth. No one's ever heard it!

[MBTC]

I get more attached to the UltraNova the more I use it. Going back to hardware has been interesting, though, sometimes in not so good ways. For example, working with soft synths you don't have to deal with things like clock sync. I have no idea why, but the UN seems to not want to sync exactly with the tempo shown in Cubase (off by 1 or 2 bpm most of the time... rarely noticeable in practice but still, sending a clock value across a wire seems like a simple enough task to do reliably). Also, if browsing patches on the synth itself, it's fast enough, but using patch up/down inside the VST editor introduces a delay as it communicates back and forth with the hardware. No where near the problems I had with Virus Control, but I assume this type of issue is considered "normal" when interfacing hardware with the DAW these days?

[TweakHead]

Yep, but in my case it's better to send midi to a synthesizer from the sound card, instead of the keyboard, which is a novation sl mk2. Don't know why, but the timing is better that way. And some sound cards, like RME, have a rock solid world clock which is very reliable.

Don't know about software integration on synths, since I don't own the TI but the C instead. But it's kind of natural, I guess. What you change on software has to be sent some way or another to the hardware to update the patch, so a little lag feels natural to me.

[MBTC]

Yep, but in my case it's better to send midi to a synthesizer from the sound card, instead of the keyboard, which is a novation sl mk2. Don't know why, but the timing is better that way. And some sound cards, like RME, have a rock solid world clock which is very reliable.

Don't know about software integration on synths, since I don't own the TI but the C instead. But it's kind of natural, I guess. What you change on software has to be sent some way or another to the hardware to update the patch, so a little lag feels natural to me.

Maybe I'm misunderstanding things (been away from hardware for too long), but I think the host (Cubase) is the source of the timing in my case. Maybe there's a way I could use the clock on the Saffire Pro24?

I can kind of understand a little lag for MIDI messages in general, especially something like bulk sysex data, but updating the tempo seems like such a simple and common task that it should be something like sending X/Y coordinates from the mouse through USB to the motherboard (i.e. instantaneous).

Oddly enough, using the UltraNova editor, I can hover the mouse cursor over the virtual cutoff knob in the VST, then use the CMC-AI knob (Cubase hardware controller) to sweep the cutoff, and it feels just as fast and responsive (maybe even a little more so) than using the dedicated filter knob on the hardware board itself! That's a signal going from a third party controller, through the DAW to the plugin, through the sound card back out the USB port to the Ultranova, and I'm guessing the polling required would be much more frequent than a bpm tempo change.

[TweakHead]

I think it will work fine if you stop and push play again. I don't think (will make this test as soon as possible) Midi would handle something like a tempo automation curve, on the project, and having to go through the Midi notes written before that. I think it just goes nutz (not 100% sure).

And you're right, the tempo is handled first hand in your DAW. But a good clock can handle this messages much better then a simple Midi interface, most specially if you happen to have a complex hardware setup with lots of instruments running (or trying to run) in sync.

But to be honest I'm really no expert on this matters, it's just based on first-hand experience. I just settled with what worked for me, and I did find the sound card handled midi better.

[TweakHead]

Back on topic. What do you guys think about this interface? I think it's one of the best of all this new wave of analogue mono synthesizers that are reaching the market now. It's balanced, seems well laid out, very intuitive, I personally like the adsr envelopes with faders instead of knobs, specially for a synthesizer with this characteristics. Seems to me that the second Bass Station is better competition for their old rival Roland SH 101, then the previous one. And it's also curious that the first was digital and the second analogue. It's like a time loop of some kind. But actually makes sense today, and shows Novation's reading the market - and probably having success with their line of hardware synths. Even though I do think that the Supernova feels more like a beast then UltraNova, even though I'm no fool and I recognize there's a lot of new tools on that, and performance wise, every other brand should be paying attention!

So... What's Roland waiting for? Every player is playing there cards now :twisted:

[MBTC]

It does re-send the time to the Ultranova when I hit play, it's just that the keyboard time rarely shows the correct BPM, its usually off by 2 or 3 (if 135 in the DAW, maybe 133 on the UN).

Honestly it's usually irrelevant to the sound, because such a small difference would require an arp'ed note to be held down for a long time before the timing felt off, (i.e. it sounds fine), but the "fuzzy value interpretation" surprised me, as did the lag in sending a simple patch up/patch down message from the VST to the board.

I guess it's just a wake up call for someone spoiled by soft-synths. I remember back in my early days of hardware only and the Atari ST, timing issues were almost always present, to the point that it could be a LOT of work just to get the overall mix sounding tight. But that was almost 25 years ago, seems like technology would have brought things further, but as they say "MIDI hasn't changed much since it was invented".. lol

[MBTC]

Back on topic. What do you guys think about this interface? I think it's one of the best of all this new wave of analogue mono synthesizers that are reaching the market now. It's balanced, seems well laid out, very intuitive, I personally like the adsr envelopes with faders instead of knobs, specially for a synthesizer with this characteristics. Seems to me that the second Bass Station is better competition for their old rival Roland SH 101, then the previous one. And it's also curious that the first was digital and the second analogue. It's like a time loop of some kind. But actually makes sense today, and shows Novation's reading the market - and probably having success with their line of hardware synths. Even though I do think that the Supernova feels more like a beast then UltraNova, even though I'm no fool and I recognize there's a lot of new tools on that, and performance wise, every other brand should be paying attention!

So... What's Roland waiting for? Every player is playing there cards now :twisted:

Yeah I sort of veered off-topic a bit.

Anyway I suspect Novation's success with this will depend on the price point of the synth. I think they've given me a free copy of the Bass Station soft synth about three times now, and I've tried it but never could discover why I needed it any more than my other synths which do bass just fine.

I thought it was a bit strange that they are calling it Bass Station II, even if that's what it is, after they've been giving away a plugin called Bass Station free for so long.

I'll look forward to hearing how it actually sounds, the video didn't demo it much. The bearded dude was taking care of all the real business with the MiniNova and UltraNova and barely touching the Bass Station II until the very end.

[TweakHead]

Yeah, maybe it's not even ready yet. Pretty much like the Pulse 2. However, Novation usually doesn't take long to actually release their products after announcing them. I do like the physical interface and the specs. Moog made a big deal out of having noise and distortion on their latest model. And this one has it to. The Korg, even though it's a reincarnation of a classic product, also has a wonderful sounding high pass filter and some extra modulation options with their semi-modular approach, with the patch bay. The Mini Brute ranks high in the filter department, it's actually based on very good circuitry and they took their time and hired one of the best for it - and it does deliver.

Pulse 2 has very good specs as well, but if I felt there should be a version of Blofeld with more knobs on it, I don't even think it makes much sense to have an analogue synth with such an interface - could be totally wrong though.

I don't get why DSI has dropped the MEK to, as it was meant to be very good competition to the Moog Sub line of synths - and priced a bit lower. In my opinion, they have much better specs on them.

So, I'd say Korg MS 20 mini, this new Novation and the Mini Brute seem to be the best bang for the buck for analogue mono synthesizers with small keyboards and affordable prices. DSI can easily compete directly with Moog in this department as well, but since it's a short company, they're probably more focused on the big brother prophet 12. But would like to see something in the lines of the MEK come up some time soon. Either pure Analogue (with knobs on it, not like the Mopho or Tetra please), or hybrids - which is probably the territory to go for nowadays, since most people like to have one foot on both sides of it anyways.

[namnibor]

Yes, the DSI MEK is one wonderful instrument and has taken my heart as my favorite, incredibly deep and capable keyboard that is actually very much "modular" in nature when you start down the rabbit hole!

The first novation Bass Station WAS/IS analog, it just employed DCO's, just as most of DSI analog synths do. The Novation Super Bass Station was rack model only and DCO's and seems the new Bass Station 2 builds upon the architecture of it as about 2/4 of specs are same as Super Bass Station, then added even more great specs. What I see omitted is the CV in/out that both the rack version of first Bass Station and Super Bass Station had, giving you essentially a midi to cv converter. This is included on MiniBrute.

I personally did not like the miniBrute when giving it a good 45 minutes at Sweetwater, an hour North in neighboring State where my parents live and I grew-up. Sure, I certainly think it's incredible bang for buck but I for one, did NOT like the sound of filter. I will also admit that could change if two variable pulse width osc's AND a sub osc were implemented on whatever Arturia release from their labs next:-)

Perhaps too, I am a bit already 'swooned' by the Korg MS20 Mini, knowing from using the original, how sweet the two osc's are and those two filters, coupled with modulation heaven with patch bay...yummm!

I actually find the Waldorf editing matrix very intuitive. Having a Blofeld Keyboard Black Edition, and had my first experience with same matrix on my first Waldorf, the Micro Q Omega (75 voice expansion model), and have absolutely no problems adjusting multiple parameters--it just takes familiarizing yourself in-use and it just *clicks*.

Yes, one has to wonder what likes of Roland and Yamaha will release, if anything, in the analog revolution! Yamaha makes a lot of their bread and butter in the educational instruments and is still right up there with Steinway in acoustic pianos. Roland would probably make a mint in making something tweaked in a real new TB. But Roland has a history of making money by making a person buy this and that if you want 'full features' and funny thing is that both Korg's orig. MS20 and Roland's TB were sold as "budget synths" and were almost considered flops as far as sales numbers go until little over decade post release, DJ's and New Wave groups such as The Cars, made people lust after them, not to mention minions of Depeche Mode cover bands...I know, as I was right in the mix.

Lastly, wouldn't it be kind of interesting now that the Kemper Amp Simulator project is a finished and available for retail sale; what if Access incorporated real analog filters alongside digital filters in which you could utilize 'hybrid filter-morphing'???
Just a little food for the gray matter! Anyone have any clues what Access is up to these days? Even hamburger joints have to do something unexpected rather than playing it safe and show-up at trade shows with same old burger and bun...just saying!:rolleyes:

[namnibor]

According to DSI, they discontinued the MEK in June, 2012 simply because it was not a 'big seller'. It certainly has a BIG sound on it's own, let alone poly chaining two desktop evolvers for three note poly. I personally think if one has other synths, the Poly Evolver could simply be 'too massive', and I will add that at least on USA Ebay, the MEK is holding value used at same or higher selling point when available new. Since the DSI Mopho x4 is NOT a keyboard version of Tetra, hence no multi timberal; it almost did not make sense releasing Mopho x4 when after reading a lot on unofficial DSi Forum now, seeing over and over in past, the most requested new product was a keyboard version of Tetra, of which, still has some major code rewriting in-progress for three years now and at least they are working on it, each beta O.S. introduces bugs never present...all this while still finishing Prophet 12! My take is if it were DSI that had introduced Total Integration, they would have worked night and day and fixed it or hired Sound Tower techs to help get it done properly...again, just saying and yes, I love my Virus C and it has been via digging deep in DSI MEK that has made me have a much proficient and creative approach with the virus architecture! Sorry so long and rant over!

[TweakHead]

Yeah, I've been looking for the MEK on ebay with no luck! There's simply nothing out there with such wild specs. I expect to see more products coming up with this hybrid approach.

The Evolver series uses a Curtis based circuit for the filter, same kind that was used in the Mini Brute - even though each manufacturer gives it his own touch. Funny that we're talking about filter circuits again, uh?

Would be interesting to see Access pull something out for this new analogue race. Hybrid would be cool, but I feel there's a lot they could try and implement even on the digital waters before going for that. There's room for smaller projects, in the likes of Waldorf's Rocket, or the Korg's MonoTribe, and stuff like that, to test the analogue waters - if they were interested in that.

Waldorf is somehow much more daring and they are quickly growing their line of products. Even though, I'll say it again, would make sense to see something in the lines of the Q keyboard show up some time soon: I know the Blofeld is pretty intuitive, a close friend of mine has one and I've had the chance to use it, but there's folks here that really want the knobs! Specially for highly complex sound engines, such as the Blofeld. They could do something in the lines of the MEK to, would be interesting!

[namnibor]

Arturia MiniBrute is not shy about advertising that it *actually* uses the "Steiner-Parker-Filter", rather than Curtis but perhaps I misunderstand in that even the "Steiner-Parker-Filter" is BASED on or BUILT on the Curtis Circuit? Have never heard Curtis Filter used in association with MiniBrute but certainly correct me/inform me if wrong here.
I would wholeheartedly *welcome* an incredibly knobby editing interface to set on all the unused synth keyboard real estate, and believe have read where there's been mapping templates made by users for Novation Remote SL Zero. Access started making such editing interfaces before the Virus line released, with coincidentally, Waldorf being one of editors made specifically for the Microwave 1. Waldorf and Access have been technology bedfellows over the years, even assisting further development of the Virus when Waldorf went bankrupt.
I will say I have watched/listened to some demos of MiniBrute on youtube that were musically pretty cool just last night, so it can be in your face rude or soft and buttery.
Novation must have done something interesting with addition of different filters rather than re-releasing carbon copy. However, the Korg MS20 mini being a faithful reproduction by same original designers is Very welcome!

[TweakHead]

Nope. My bad. I thought its filter was based on the Curtis circuit, but instead it's the "Steiner-Parker" like you said. It's also a very famous circuit, but think it was redesigned for this specific model and is a full multi-mode analogue self-oscillating filter - which is a rare thing, specially on this price range. I never tested it in loco, like you did, so I really can't say much, but did like the sound of the demos and videos. And that "metalizer" function introduces some very sharp harshness to the sound, sort like FM sound, but with a different touch.

But it's more then natural. Some people like the sound of a given filter, and that's a big part of the character of a given synthesizer.

As for the Novation, it has the original circuit I think

One of the features that made the Bass Station, as Novation co-founder Ian Jannaway puts it, “an all-time classic of the synth world” was its filter, designed by Chris Huggett (who has been associated with Novation ever since) and based on the unique filter he had designed for the famous OSCar synthesiser a few years before.

And the new one, of course. Also multi-mode. Seems nice, but will have to wait for some sound demos and proper show off videos.

[MBTC]

Here's the sweetwater demo vid of this synth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ezc0Ga_mlFw

Not going to single handedly replace the rest of your gear collection to be sure, but at the price point it seems pretty good.

Here's another vid as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZD0Q1UF7Eo

[Berni]

Here's the sweetwater demo vid of this synth:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=ezc0Ga_mlFw

Not going to single handedly replace the rest of your gear collection to be sure, but at the price point it seems pretty good.

Here's another vid as well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WZD0Q1UF7Eo

The guy demoing it has even less of a clue than me about synths, Lol!

The English guy knows his stuff though.

[namnibor]

Yes, the second demo from actual Novation guy was much better. Kind of surprised they chose to not have cv/out/cv/in with plethora of analog gear and increased interest in modular systems these days. But then again and as he stated, getting best of analog and digital control here! Although have never owned a Roland Sh101 but have heard it in person played, this sounds like a bit more complicated "Roland-ish sound" and of course much more capable. I actually hear from the new multi-mode filter nuances of original Pro One especially in deep bass range. Here some "John Carpenter" like bass sounds from his early movies.
My Waldorf Pulse Plus analog rack has CV to midi converter with cv/in cv/out and am interested in something with keys to control it effectively, but may just resort to good old midi as fully spec'd in that department.
Bass Station 2 *is* a very sexy looking synth. Very cool there's an audio external input and that all the controls send midi cc and can be mapped for those whom use soft synths as well.
A bit off topic but certainly related: Korg's MS20 is being manufactured in China and what read on forums, seems that's where the quality control issues lay in order to mass produce at that price point. Hope they get that sorted because last thing a person wants is a new synth with pots becoming scratchy fast on a synth that begs to be tweaked.
Kudos to Novation for having after touch on the Bass Station 2 keys!!!:D

[MBTC]

The guy demoing it has even less of a clue than me about synths, Lol!

The English guy knows his stuff though.

I got the "clueless" vibe from both, I probably should have put in the disclaimer that these should be used only for listening to the sounds.

Everytime I hear a "sales demo" of any synth, it's painful because they sit there and drone on about the obvious that anyone who has spent more than an hour learning synthesis already knows.

However, the English guy did show off some of the features better, but it makes sense because he is a Novation employee that has a smaller product line to get familiar with, whereas the other guy is a Sweetwater employee that has to try to sell a gazillion products from a gazillion vendors. And the Novation rep got the opportunity to try to sell us some other Novation stuff at the same time :)

[MBTC]

Kudos to Novation for having after touch on the Bass Station 2 keys!!!:D

And $500 retail. It will be crazy if we see street prices of $400 for this synth a year after intro.

Novation seems good at understanding the need to provide bang for buck.

[MBTC]

Here's a soundcloud demo to add to the above:

https://soundcloud.com/novationmusic/bass-station-ii-first-listen

[namnibor]

All this would be quite moot if for some odd reason something either were to drastically change with our Sun and Earth to where electromagnetism and generation of electrical power were no longer possible because we would then be fighting off those that would be wanting to steal our acoustic instruments for firewood!

Yeah, my brain works this way; especially when listening to some fine Classical music and hearing what was done without electricity at all!:twisted:

Now, are those VCO or DCO's on the Bass Station 2???:p Think the original BS and Super BS had DCO's and know from looking at them in pawn shop once, the knobs were way too small and close together and the keyboard version of the first one looked like a toy compared to this new 2013 synth.

I too, agree that Focusrite and Novation can be more reasonable in bang for buck. However, I *still* think I paid way too much for my Remote SL 61MK2 controller. I love it but Novation seems ONLY concerned about "Automap" and not those of us whom use hardware synths and want to make our own templates because I sure wish I had known when I bought it that when NOT using Automap, a good percentage of buttons and such simply do not have ANY function:confused:. Seemed only 6 months post purchase, Novation then released *yet another* full line of cheaper controllers called 'Impulse' which definitely have crap-tastic key-action compared to the Remote SL MK2. Rant over and back OT; I see Bass Station 2 as a direct competitor to the Minibrute, and other than the 'brute's cv/in/out gate/in/out, being a much more versatile instrument because the 'brute's midi spec is nowhere near the Bass Station 2 either.

[Audiofan]

Hi everyone! We just finished our review and test of BS2 here: http://en.audiofanzine.com/analog-synth/novation/bass-station-ii/editorial/reviews/nice-little-fatty.html

Comments most welcome!

[namnibor]

Great review! I think the omission of key follow for filter and in a new "analog spring" to also omit cv/gate in/out, which would make it more utilitarian in working "outside the box" with the many options out there now, and the sharing of one set of sliders for both envelopes kind of sucky for live manipulation smoothly. Lastly, since part of the BS2 is obviously digital, it makes no sense as the review stated, "...the USB connection does not allow access to the outside world..." (paraphrased), which if that is fact, although there's midi DIN in/out, integration in DAW via USB not being possible, and USB 1.1 at that????
Well, the Waldorf Pulse 2, albeit $300. more, offers much more versatile options, to include CV/Gate, in addition to being able to use low pass filter and high pass filter in series.
BS2 seems like a great option on a budget and the added rather cool sequencer with 4 stored memories not locked to any set program just makes me think had Novation just made this a three octave synth, they could have had knob/sliders per function and a future buy for me. As it stands, find the Minibrute, MS20, and Waldorf Pulse 2 much more viable options for what I wish to do with synthesis and making music. Do not get me wrong, the sound is great but when a user interface is somewhat limited with so many shared functions, well, that's subjective I realize and others may not find these things cumbersome.