Ultranova - Got one! Here are my thoughts..
 

I picked one of these up because:

1. I'm a former hardware guy turned software guy, but I still have gear lust and wanted to start dabbling in hardware again without quite yet blowing a wad on more expensive synths that I've been eyeballing
2. It was cheap ($600 new) / good specs for the price
3. Everyone that has one of these seems to love it
4. The software integration was intriguing, and unlike the virus VC software everyone seems thrilled with the software plugin.
5. I always liked the Supernova sound. I'm a weirdo that actually likes VA as much or more than true analog
6. I had listened to one at a music store and it seemed like a lot of synth for the money
7. The touch - knobs were interesting
8. I use a Novation MIDI controller already and a Focusrite audio interface, and think fondly of their gear

For a couple of days I just plugged it in worked through patches and programming using headphones. There is definately an "instantaneous" feel to a hardware synth that takes some fiddling to duplicate in a purely software environment. It could be mostly psychological, but when you play through factory patches on a hardware synth, most of them have been tweaked to take advantage of that board, with regard to mod wheel, aftertouch etc.

One of my "tests" of a synth is to create some sort of resource draining wet supersaw-type unison patch (or sometimes a string pad-like sound with a very long release) and then play a bunch of notes to get a feel for when polyphony starts dropping out (or in the case of some soft-synths, when the CPU meter gets rediculously high). I have to say here that the Ultranova fared better with this than I expected. I literally A/B'd it up against Zebra, which can be a monstrous supersaw beast if you don't mind parting with some CPU to get there. I put the Ultranova's 3 oscillators (unison x 4), fattented with some chorus and delay against Zebra's 4 oscillators running in "Eleven" mode (44 osc!), and tried to get the detune settings about the same on each. They were almost indistinguishable! With a long release envelope (which would not be typical for a patch like this anyway), there was a point where of course the Ultranova started dropping notes but it was at a point where Zebra2 would have been using an inordinate amount of CPU if used in a real track with other things going on, and would have most likely needed to be bounced down to an audio clip anyway.

Now the shocker? This was phenomenally better than the Virus Ti2 Desktop did in my very unscientific benchmarking experiments with polyphony a few years ago when I briefly had my hands on one. I did not perform the exact same steps, so this is an admittedly subjective evaluation, and thus nobody should quote me as saying the Ultranova is more powerful than the Virus Ti2. Also, there was so much wrestling with the VirusControl software and the driver at that time, that I did not have as much time to spend learning how to program the Virus as I already learned in a matter of hours with the trouble-free Ultranova, so it is by no means a fair comparison. I'm just saying that for a 3 osc synth with limited capabilities on paper, it can sound surprisingly fat and hold its own with polyphony.

Now shocker #2. The editor, running as a plug-in in FLStudio, just friggin works. No latency, no crashes, no excuses, it just seems to work and communicate beautifully with the synth over USB. Although again this is not quite an apples-to-apples comparison with Virus Control because I'm not using the Ultranova's built in audio interface like I was with the Virus, and I also am sending audio from the outs over 1/4 to the interface. The comparison here is not really to say the Ultranova software works and Virus Control doesn't, it's just that the out of box experience, comparing the Ultranova in 2013 to my experience with VC in 2009 is like night and day different. From what I've read, the VC problems still exist for most folks... what's going on, Access?

I've really only messed with this synth on the surface, but the editor is REALLY nice, and where things stand right now I'm quite happy with the purchase.

About the only negative thing I could say about it yet is that 37 keys really cramps my style for all but a few one-handed type uses. Just having another octave on my Novation remote makes a big difference in terms of actually putting down an arrangement. If I do get another Virus, I don't think I will get a desktop like I did before, but rather splurge for a 61-key.

{updating with new information... I did eventually upgrade my main controller to an MKII 61-key after this thread}

Back to the only negative, with a 37-key synth like this, you sometimes find that some patches sound good only within the limited number of octaves offered by the synth, maybe one up and one down. It is harder to make sounds sound great across more octaves, and most folks don't bother with a synth with this many keys.

I still have a lot to learn about it but if anyone has specific questions I'd be glad to try to answer.

Nice purchase, i got a Mininova and i like it very much because of its real timeperformance buttons (as the touch sensitive knobs on the Ultranova).

The sounds are great, and the vst interface is a winner.

3 octaves are synth-friendly for me; sometimes it's better to use 2 keyboards for sound purposes, i mean 2 different sounds. But if you like to use more keys your second keyboard solution is the right choice.

If you would like to share some custom made sounds let me know.

Kind of amazing value overall, aren't they? When you consider the sound itself, the software integration, the hardware features (real time tweak buttons/touch, etc), and overall quality, these boards might be one of the better values out there. Just the fact that I can put something like a reverby lead or a pad or something onto this can save me something like 15-20% CPU in a real mix without even bouncing down, which is more than the numbers indicate since my projects typically start flaking out if they get over 70% CPU or so.

For the keys, I've been getting by with 49 keys for my primary controller for years now, but I originally cut my teeth on 61 and that's always what feels most natural for me when playing, so that will be my target size for my next KB. I didn't get the Ultranova for a primary controller, I will still use the Remote SL 49 for that for now.

{updating many months later for reference... my old 49'er eventually crapped out!... MKII I have now seems better, we'll see though...}

I haven't really gotten around to creating many sounds yet but will touch base with you on swapping when I do.

I think you've got a Virus also, if I'm not mistaken -- curious which model and in your opinion how does the overal Nova sound compare and contrast?

Yes i got a Virus C desktop and i love it.
Compared to the Mininova i found it to be a little more deep and obscure in some timbres. The pads made with the Virus are incredible.

On the other hand the Mininova got an interesting grit and overdrive that is quite unique to me. It reminds me a kind of analog saturation that is amazing on custom made sounds.
It beats the Virus C on the vst integration and the real time tweaking using the performance buttons.

The only weak points of my Mininova is the lack of knobs of course and the monotimbrality, but the Virus C and the Novas got strong timbres that could be very similar to each other, but also be different with their own distinct character.

I forgot to say that i sold a DSI Tetra for the Mininova, and i would never go back. The Tetra is analog but retro sounding and a pain to program. And its sounds got many limits.

The Novas are powerful and eclectic.

I still have my Novation Supernova 1 rack and keep it because it really is a capable beast and much different sound to Virus KC, so the variety works for me, plus the highly capable polyphonic 8 track arp allows for the versatile use of effects per part without limitations. Only other Novation own is my favorite controller, Remote SL 61 MKII with two midi outs...I really do not work well with a smaller keybed with only exception being 39 key DSI MonoEvolverKeyboard--that just works for it's massive sound canvas! Glad you guys seem to have no glitches with it's vst integration though.

In terms of sound, how much is the Ultranova like the original Supernova? Can you tell, from hearing them, that they are from the same family (like the Virus A, B, C are to the TI), or are they totally new synth engines? How does it fit in compared against the K-Station series, too, given they have similar feature sets?

Reason being, I checked out a few Ultranova audio demos and reviews on youtube and unfortunately I was disappointed with all of them. To me sounds like it has a kinda plasticky, digital, thin, phasey sound to it. I did however like the K-Station demos from a few years ago.

For example on the Sonic State overview...



... the supersaw at 2:57 onwards on the Ultranova sounds horribly phasey and weak when dialing in the detune and hitting new keys (more specifically it resets the trig phase of all the multiple detuned saws at note-on each time, so you get a "peeow, peeow" sound every time you press a key as they all start in phase then detune away from each other, rather than starting them as free-running entities to begin with, regardless of detune amount) and I've noticed this undesirable artefact effect is common in other people's Ultranova demos too. My Korg Radias does the same thing and I hate it. Furthermore, there appears to be no compensation for the change in volume that is heard when all the saw waves are being phased triggered at note-on (i.e. when they're all summed, creating a large spike in volume at note-on, then decaying away as the individual saws separate), compared to whether they were all free running phase wise (always a more consistent, average level). Same problem with the Radias, so unfortunately I end up never using the supersaw oscillator type.

You say the Ultranova fairs better at supersaws than the TI|2? The original TI|1 had 80 voices of poly using the hypersaw, whereas the Ultranova has upto 18 note poly, so not sure how you figured that?

Monotimbrality is a bit disappointing.

However I really liked the idea of the extended LFO waveforms, some effectively as mini step sequencers. No idea why most synth companies fail to add more musical, creative LFO shapes like these, and instead restrict themselves to just the Sin/Tri/Sq/Saw waveforms (useful though they are, it would be nice to have more creativity and variety).

I do like the touch sensitive knobs, that's a good performance feature for triggering multiple modulations on cue.

Overall very good for the price, though. The price of Virus in comparison is ridiculous.

However, for the price, one could get Blofeld, which has a much more powerful and versatile synth engine. After to listening to the review again posted that indeed had seen many when UltraNova first was released; compared to sound of the Supernova or dare say even the Nova tabletop, it sounds more like casio cz series reboxed and used the "Nova" name to give some sort of pseudo legacy. Six envelopes are great to have if the sound engine has a massive capability to sculpt it without sounding as Timo rightly said, VERY phasey. Perhaps Novation was simply going for mainly the DJ market? Too bad Novation seemed to drop original Supernova line after the Supernova 2 rack. Having said that, and knowing the Supernova 2 has many more great functions added than my original Supernova 1 rack, I would not trade it for any of the 'bastard grandchildren' of the 'Nova-namesake' post-Supernova 2. Novation do make awesome controllers (Remote SL MKII series), of which it seems touch sensative controls and exact same screen are used on the Ultranova, but as the review showed, those encoders looked like they would not take much abuse without trepidation; of which, the Remote Sl MKII does not suffer from. (a buddy of mine said as much as he even hated Roland's Gaia, he felt they easily could have been designed by same engineers...he owned both at different times for less than a week)
On a similar note that Timo mentioned about Korg Radias; it's definitely going to be sold or even donated to university music dept. as it is very underwhelming compared to other synths am working with and try as I may, the Radias ALWAYS wants to sound so fraking HAPPY and plasticky. The Virus's older engines still eat most of anything out there for breakfast, lunch, dinner, and scooby snacks inbetween!!:rolleyes:

Yes, it's that gritty quality that comes out of the Nova quickly that I think I like so much. On certain sounds it reminds me of a hardware version of Massive, although the programming UI is very different.

With regard to the nova vs. virus on pads, its hard for me to comment because I never judge a synth by the presets, I learned my lesson with a number of softsynths, where the presets sound blah but some of the aftermarket soundsets are amazing. I think the same is true with the Virus, default sounds on the Ti2 as I recall,....not so great, but I know the Virus can go sonically where I want because I've heard 3rd party sounds that do. So, the pads on the Ultranova presets are okay at best, but I've already played around with it to know that they can be fattened up quite a bit with a little tweaking. I plan to see what's available for aftermarket sound sets on this... right now it seems some of the soundcloud links from Novations website aren't even working, how are they going to sell those sounds?

There is definately a level of programming complexity here that is available via the VST that would be difficult to do same from just the knobs and display. That is one of the limits of hardware-only synths that I wanted to avoid, and why the Ultranova and Virus are higher on my wish list. Things like adjusting the slope of individual lines on the ADSR envelopes... I guess it is doable with knobs but it's not the same if you're reading numbers, requires a visual representation I think.

Since I've been playing with it, I've run into a few glitches with the VST but I'm not sure how many are related to the host (FLS), my vid card, etc. One is just that the VST sometimes does not paint the window properly sometimes (just a visual bug), which seems minor because I can close and reopen it to fix that (inconvenient but seems to work). The other is that a few times last night, my entire host crashed. I have seen that on rare occasion with a few softsynth plugins, and my remedy was to run the VST in bridged mode (which I guess runs the plugin in its own process so it can't crash the host). So far so good in bridged mode but I'm keeping an eye on it. One good thing about hardware synths is that even if you're entire host goes tits up, at least the synth still has all the sound data :) Of course it's not good if you're arranging a track and your synth brings down all of your recent project work with the plugin :).... As I said, bridged mode seems to fix that particular problem as far as I can see from here, and I'm not sure whether to blame the plugin or the host. I'm also using the Saffire audio interface instead of the one built into the Ultranova... I saw someone on the FLS forum say that they could only get the Ultranova to work via USB with its own audio interface, though it was an older post. Maybe I'm doing something unconventional here that's throwing a monkey wrench in, using USB to interface with the synth, but using the Saffire for everything else.

We'll have to see about long term VST stability but so far I'm still quite pleased.

Unfortunately it's been a while (long time actually) since I've heard a Supernova, so it's hard for me to compare actual sound. Instinctually I think the characteristics of the Ultranova remind me of the Supernova.
Supposedly the Ultranova's engine is not exactly the same as the Supernova II but architecturally similar and supposedly much more powerful. Some folks claim to notice a more digital sound out of the Ultranova.

I think some of the default sounds are kind of thin but with a little experimentation I was able to get things to my liking, although your mileage may vary. When playing a synth like this, I can't help being biased by the overall price, so if I have to tweak a little more to get the sound I want, the price makes that less painful. Whereas if I pay five times the price for a Virus I have very high expectations for even default sounds and if I have to get deep under the hood to make something sound good to my ears it tends to tick me off.

Well one thing to keep in mind is that around that point in the demo, he has only dialed up a single oscillator and detuned it. To start approaching something that sounds more like a thick supersaw, take what he did, set Unison x 4, then detune unison... But...wait, you still have two more free oscillators to use :) plus a noise osc. So bring those next two osc in, detune each to maybe +/- 7 and maybe put one on a different octave, etc., then add some reverb, delay etc and you're going to have a much different sound, something like a proper dreamtrance supersaw that way.

I'm not 100% sure if I can properly address this other than to say that in that demo he probably left the OscPhase param set to default which is 0 degrees. If you set it to "free" it removes that quality that I think you're talking about. The range is 0 to 357. It is one of those params that would is somewhat obscure and could be overlooked in many demos. You need to hit the Oscillator button, and use Next to get to the screen. I duplicated what the guy in the video did with one Osc, and set it to free and the initial click disappeared. Hope that helps?

Oh, no I didn't :) Please read what I wrote again, I was afraid I was giving that impression and opening myself up a can of worms. I was just describing an overall initial impression of a couple of weeks I spent working with the Ti2. For all I know I may not have had something configured properly. It was just a comment about the out of box experience. The Virus started giving up the ghost on polyphony in rediculous places like Roland D50-ish bell sounds, which (again at the price point) left me disappointed.

Again I will refer to comment above and previous post, but one thing I noticed about the Ti2 is that it seemed every little thing I did seemed to affect "patch complexity", which was indicated by a small meter on the display. Once you introduce any level of complexity, it started robbing notes out of the patch left and right. I may be sticking my neck out here for the chopping block here, because I do not have specs available, but I honestly feel that the DSP in the Ultranova is roughly on a par, if not faster than that in the Ti2, based on very subjective and non-scientific evaluation that took place several years apart :) Not sure how to say it any more wishy washy than that... hehe

Agreed, that could be an issue for some folks, it was considered prior to my purchase and is not an issue for my particular needs.

Yes, one thing about the LFO sequence-type waveforms, I can't see that those are editable. I know most hardware probably wouldn't have them at all, but if you're used to working with softsynths like Zebra where you can literally implement any sort of modulation you could possibly draw with a mouse, the limitations of hardware are stifling to say the least, and I'm still unconvinced there is any real sound benefit to a hardware VA synth vs a good quality softsynth.

Yep, they are awesome.

Definitely. One reason I got this synth is to sort of dabble with "well integrated" hardware, to stick my foot back in the hardware synth water and decide how much of a financial commitment I want to make toward it. I've been somewhat spoiled with the ultra smooth workflow of softsynths, not having cables everywhere, not having to jump through hoops to get midi clocks sync'ed up and volume levels right and so forth. I think these synths are a phenomenal value. May or may not be for everyone's needs but it is certainly scratching the itch I bought it to scratch.

This thread cooled off a little, but I would like to encourage any questions from anybody, because it motivates me to get under the hood and learn specific things faster. The manual for this thing is actually quite good and the synth parameters are surprisingly deep and varied.

A few more observations since my last post while reading about the Ultranova elsewhere:

1. Much of the (legitimate) negative feedback I've heard from folks who have tried this synth relates to lack of multi-timbrality. I can understand why this preludes using it as the only synth in one's arsenal; however, often on multi-timbral synths, using a single complex sound uses so many resources that using additional sounds results in such a polyphony reduction that it defeats the purpose. So, I say at the given price point, someone could always buy 5 of these things, keep two and a half band-members hands busy, and across them play 90 notes of 5 different complex patches and still have spent less than a Virus Ti2 keyboard. That's a silly scenario but it puts the value proposition in perspective.

2. Some of the demos I've seen on youtube have been "low-end limited" by the 37 keys. Typically when I hear a synth being played in a manner that I can be sure it's going to meet my needs, it is done with 2 hands that are 3 to 4 octaves away from each other. Without enough physical keys to do that, I think most of the demos I've seen are playing at higher octaves, thus result in a thinner sound. So there may be a kind artificial drawback there, that leads to a real drawback (see #3)

3. There appears to be very little aftermarket sound packs available for this synth. I can see a few potential reason for that... a sound designer probably wants a larger controller, which can be done but at the expense of being farther away from the knobs that provide the immediate interface and take advantage of the UN like the touch knobs, etc. So, much of the sound design would probably require lots of hands on with the plug-in. I've had pretty good luck with the VST but I've read from guys who did not have as much luck with other forms of the plugin, at least in the early days. I saw a post from Rob Lee, who is a very good sound designer, asking Novation to contact him about writing a sound pack for the Ultranova (I don't know what ever came of it except there is no Rob Lee sound pack for the UN that I know of). Why is this? Novation's handling of things or interaction with the community? I don't know, but there may be a combination of issues that resulted in not much aftermarket sounds being available for this synth. Good news is it is very easy to program yourself, bad news is the presets do not showcase the synth and there's not much available that will. It becomes a very DIY synth, which I think is fun but others may not.

4. The modulation is really good. But things like preset arp patterns are irritatingly limiting to me (to some extent the very editable gator effect could be used for this I think).

5. Price always seems to be listed in the $700+ range. I picked this one up for $600 out the door via Amazon, perhaps because its been out a couple of years (too bad Virus rarely drops in price)... and the Mininova can be had for even less. At those prices we're approaching the cost of the better softsynths but getting much so much more for the money.

For convenience, I rounded up some of the review links I came across, posting for posterity here. The synthtopia one has a good look around the plugin... Interesting quote from keyboard mag "Given what the present UltraNova does with just one part, though, I might go so far as to call it the deepest implementation of the virtual analog paradigm next to Arturia’s Origin—which lists for $3,200. This makes the UltraNova one of the most outstanding synth values you can buy":

http://www.synthtopia.com/content/20...hesizer-review

http://www.keyboardmag.com/article/N...UltraNova/4414

http://www.emusician.com/gear/0769/n...-review/140117

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/feb1...-ultranova.htm

http://www.tonylongmusic.co.uk/keybo...supernova-gaia

http://www.groovypost.com/reviews/no...tranova-review

http://www.junodownload.com/plus/201...tranova-review

http://www.residentadvisor.net/review-view.aspx?id=8544

Nice selection of varied reviews there! I really wonder why Novation jumped in really no time at all and implimented a mini-me version with indeed twinkle-toe keys rather than offering a 61 key version of the UN?
Wouldn't it be an awesome thing for a company to make such a synth that to expand all you had to do was buy another, then remove an end-cap of each and connect the two for a 74 key, then-biTimberal synth?
I read some things on gearslutz where people actually found the computer integration/editor/vst part of UN to work best actually using the UN as the actual audio interface AND the Automap seemed to be pretty important for that to work well. They also said in that same thread that the UN is really USB-hungry in that when using UN as the interface via USB, it used most of the available bandwidth and to avoid problems, they actually were successful in using an A/C powered USB hub. (I forgot to save that gearslutz.com thread in faves). Read people really liked the action of the keys as well.;)

About the Mini, I think almost all aspects are the same except lacks built in audio interface and of course is smaller and costs less. There are some aspects of the knobs and buttons I actually like better on the Mini, but I don't do well with small keys so I needed an Ultra.

Currently, I'm not using the interface in the UN, I run the audio to the Saffire Pro 24 (which is firewire) and a MIDI cable, but the UN is plugged into USB because the plugin needs it. That's one reason its not a fair comparison against the Virus with VC, because at that time (my brief stint with a virus) I was trying to do everything over USB, and its hard to tell how many of my problems were a result of that. Only drawback I can find to the current setup is one of MIDI sync, that changing the tempo in the DAW sometimes seems to take and other times I have to hit play to get it to send the new tempo to the UN (could be the software or just the way things are in the hardware world). That's not something I do every 10 seconds though.

I used to use Automap fairly frequenly with my 49 key controller, but over time I found myself using it less because of the load time it added to each plugin. The new PC does not yet have Automap on it so I have not tried that aspect. I haven't even really used the top row of buttons (right under the knobs) because they are apparently all designed for use with Automap. I guess the idea there is that for folks using the UN as their primary controller, it would be silly not to be able to use Automap like every other controller Novation makes so it was a must-have for some. I probably will not use the UN as my primary controller only due to # of keys, but the laptop-producers on the go will probably love that feature of it.

About the key-action, I think it's about what I want in a synth -- light (as opposed to weighted) for fast or percussive playing (as opposed for the piano feel). Some equate light with cheap but I think quality-wise it feels like Novations other controllers (good for what I do) and things like aftertouch feel right to me.

It's one of those synths that does some things well and other things not.

Sounds it does well: Edgy, punchy, gritty, screamy sounds, trance/hardstyle, dub filth etc. plucks, stabs, etc are good! Basses are good! Formant-vocaly sounding stuff is good and you sometimes stumble on extremely interesting stuff just by playing with moduling things like sync, detune. You can also modulate the waveform index (changing the fundamental sound type of the osc), slew the LFOs and other "interesting" things.

Sounds I would NOT use it for: 80's retro, true analog warmth, bread and butter, mega-layered texture sounds. You can achieve layers and textures by getting creative with modulation it but I don't think its the strength.

As some of those reviews said, one thing that's nice is you can make a single osc sound pretty fat then modulate a different osc with a completely different waveform to get a sound that would be like a multi in another synth, yet it seems to almost offer up the same polyphony no matter how complex you make things. Inside a DAW you could also just layer it with a softsynth or whatever to get whatever multi effect you want, but some folks are used to having that right on the board.

Here is an interesting post I saw on KVR....

The guy who says "I have the Virus TI2 Polar and x2 Ultra Novas.. i bought another Ultra Nova just for more parts as i love the sound. I wish Novation had made the Ultra Nova 4 part or more cause the sound appeals more to me than my Virus. The Virus is a great sound but the Ultra Nova's get more use. I hope Novation considers producing a new Synth with more parts/polyphonic in future." is none other than Rob Lee, who I would say is one of the better sound designers for EDM type sounds out there at the moment (or at least the type of sounds I aim for).

If you're not familiar with his sound sets, you can hear them at this link. I guess if you don't like his sounds, you may not agree with him about the Ultranova sound :)
http://www.roblee-music.com

Maybe I'll contact him to see why he doesn't make a sound pack for the UN. I read somewhere something about editing large numbers of sounds on it is a bit of a hassle even with the librarian, so maybe that's it. Also I know he was trying to contact Novation about doing one and was having trouble getting in touch with them, so maybe he's built up enough of a reputation that he can hold out for the big bucks :)... Given his talent and the lack of sound packs available for this synth, I'd think that would be a killer opportunity for him.

I also found it weird that Adam Van Baker owns a Virus but claims it doesn't get as much actual use in his music as Zebra and Massive. He even wrote a Jupiter 8000 inspired plugin but has never down a soundset for the Virus to my knowledge? Weird.

Namnibor asked in another thread for an update, so I thought I'd post here:

I've finally downloaded the free sounsets for the Ultranova and went through them. Most of the sounds therein aren't particularly impressive, although there are some neat emulations of Supertramp, The Who, and the intro to Fly Like An Eagle (Steve Miller Band) that really show what a good sound designer Daniel Fisher is, or maybe how versatile the Ultranova can be. For a lot of people the lack of third party sounds available for this synth could be a real drawback. Its a good synth for sound designers and folks that like to come up with their own stuff, but sometimes it's nice to have a large library of starting points for any given genre. My main motivation for getting it is to see how well I can get accustomed to a hardware+software environment after having been so spoiled by the fantastic workflow of software-only. Even doing things like sysex import/exports introduce what seems like a weird workflow interruption after not having dealt with it in years. But I'm still very pleased with the purchase... some of the Daniel Fisher sounds show that the touch knobs should not be neglected when creating new sounds, as that's one of the things that makes the Nova synths unique. It also adds a greater expectation for the sound designer I think -- i.e. do something useful with the touch knobs for each sound. That could be intimidating for some designers with regard to how much extra work should be invested into perfecting each sound. The good news is that if you're the type that likes to create sounds from scratch, there's tons of fun to be had with all the modulation possibilities (and realistically you don't always really have to start from scratch, you can always start with one of the built in sounds as a starting point).

Nice! Yes, I have often used an existing sound from a rom bank on Virus KC as a starting point but what's so nice on KC is with any given preset or your own sound, all the LED's make it easier to see how a sound was made and deconstruct it. Perhaps you should task yourself to make an outstanding sound bank or two for the ultra nova and then sell them since you say there's not much out there and ca$h-in?:D

That thought crossed my mind, although right now I'd be happy just to find the free time to learn the beast very thoroughly, and it probably sounds more enviable than it really is but I need free time more than I need more money. Also it would be hard for me to sit down and create a bank of something like 50-60 sounds. I'd get too distracted with each individual one, and the next thing I know I will have spent the bulk of the time trying to build a track around a single sound and tweaking the sound to fit that mix rather that creating lots of good sounds.

Focus, Focus, Focus!!!:rolleyes: I know what you mean because when I sit down with DSI Mono Evolver Keyboard, it's as if I create a wormhole, space/time distortion and have to force myself to get-up to drink water let alone lavatory breaks! What is that Ultravox song, "And Time Stood Still"?

Hey! I thought of you right away when firstly opening an email from Novation today (I own a Supernova 1 Rack), and this link I am posting will take you to the first of two FREE SOUNDPACKS for both Ultra/MiniNOVA and they are actual patches from the pretty awesome still IMO, of the mighty SUPERNOVA!!! You had mentioned the lack of soundpacks and Novation seem to be in full gear...http://us.novationmusic.com/soundpacks

I think to get the second free soundpack all you have to do is LIKE them on Facebook. Marketing, you know but hope this works for you!
Lastly, I recently read that on the UltraNova, you can save with each patch rather than Globally, your expression pedal midi cc modulation assignment. I think we can do this on all strains of the Virus as well but I think it was on homerecording.com where someone's problem was answered in regard to this because that person *assumed* their expression pedal settings would carry over from one patch to another and in case you did not know, thought to toss that in the "care package of a message here":-P I am pretty sure they said you can set the max/min amount/values of travel of the pedal as well rather than just a 1-127 general value!!
Cheers!

I greatly appreciate the note, although these sound packs have been out for a while, and I do already have them. I think Novation released them around the time they released the synth itself, and they touted an ongoing commitment to sounds which they unfortunately have not really made good on. In my opinion they are sort of along the ilk of "preset material", in the sense that they are good to have as a starting point but they do not begin to exploit the possibilities of the synth.

The Daniel Fisher sounds are kind of an exception, because there are what I would call some seriously fun novelty patches, like a redo of the intro riff from Fly Like an Eagle (Steve Miller Band), that unique boing sound from Life's Been Good (Joe Walsh) and other 70's analog fun. He really is quite good at understanding what makes a sound and recreating difficult ones.

I did exchange emails with Rob Lee some time back, and he said he is currently on the road traveling but when he gets back, he will resume work on his UltraNova sound set which is due out in July. That's exciting if you're into EDM sounds because he has done some fantastic work on soundsets for other synths. He has had a love-hate relationship with the UltraNova. He liked it better than his Virus Ti2, enough so to buy two of them and send them off to have them recolored (complete with letter screen prints) in black and white (the blue did not work with his studio color coordination apparently)! Then he got frustrated with them because of no unison spread feature (with the Ultranova you can accomplish similar using other mechanisms, but it upset him anyway) so he sold both those boards. He then decided he missed them and the great VST editor so he ordered two more :) So, not being able to be 100% the release of his sound pack will happen, I'm just crossing my fingers but at the same time not holding my breath. This synth is one that most folks will be able to start with a preset as a starting point and create lots of great sounds themselves. Still, I'd like to see at least one great soundset so it will be fantastic if Rob decides to complete that project. I know of at least one other prominent sound designer that is considering doing a soundpack for it, but he has not yet purchased one so I'm not counting my chickens on that one until I hear more from him.

Sorry about that, as the Novation email certainly made it seem as if those were *brand new* and on another note, in same email they touted a brand new Novation Forum here;;;http://forum.novationmusic.com/?utm_...ce=Emailvision

*BUT* they state if you had signed-up before March 26, your sign-in credentials were no longer valid. I certainly do not recall finding a Novation Forum to glean tips from fellow Supernova 1 users a few years ago and what I have compiled came from various forum searches. We must keep in mind that the internet is in all honesty, rather young in mass access and no longer in the "modem age", and technology is vastly evolving faster than the human condition, which at times almost seems devolution when one watches local news anywhere and see 12 thru 16 year olds shooting people over a cell phone or stealing copper, parts of cars--all to feed drug habits, of which, in the 80's you never heard of a pothead killing anyone for their box of twinkies...we were always PREPARED for the inevitable next morning of waking up with melted M&M's and bright colored spots on body from falling asleep with the feedbag of M&M's:p !!
Sorry, a bit of a digression there!
Anyway, it's a reminder of how tech and modem days used to be when looking through the Waldorf FTP Server Archives hosted on electro-music.com, and on that note, Waldorf has absolutely no interest in hosting an official forum and although they DO make some awesome synths, they are not so much into the communicative thing or customer service thing at all...weird!
I digress a lot lately! The M&M thing DID happen to me once:cool: !
On a viral note, has their been *any* peep or hint at what or even if people at Access are up to now that the Kemper Amp Simulator project is finished and retailed? Please let it be they had a bonfire of everything USB 1.1:rolleyes:

About forums -- to me it hasn't really changed that much. I used to run (non-music related) BBS systems back in the days of the Atari 8-bit, then MS-DOS based forums in the early-mid 80s, and we had things like CompuServe, The Source, etc. where vendors would create discussion forums. To me, not much has changed except the way we access them.

Funny but true story... Back when I used to run one BBS, there was a screechy voiced 12 year old kid who would dial into my board every day, and incessantly ring the sysop chat buzzer to chat with me. He was a bright kid but could be annoying at times (actually I was kind of a kid too, I was only a little bit older than him). I talked to him on the phone more than once (dont remember why, probably computer troubleshooting stuff). His handle on the board was Dave the Wave. We never really talked music, I didn't know he was into it.
Well, he grew up to be Dave Dresden of the famous duo "Gabriel and Dresden", who are considered two of the most successful North American born DJs/producers of electronic music during the last decade. He even kept the name "Dave the Wave" as a DJ!! I really like some of their work, I think they split up for a while and did solo projects and are now back working together. I did not keep in touch with Dave but I'm quite sure he mellowed out after puberty :)

As far as where the Virus is headed, I'm really not sure. I would like to see them come out with a mega-powerful Virus that really justifies the price point and breaks the current polyphony barriers, but the TI line uses dual Freescale 56321 DSP processors, and to my knowledge Freescale hasn't even made a more powerful chip, so it could be Kemper is waiting for a major advancement from his chip supplier before he can provide a major advancement in the Virus line? I'm only guessing here. It could be a potential challenge, for example, to fully utilize a third or fourth DSP and still retain backward compatibility with existing Virus patches. I don't think a non-backward compatible Virus would do well these days against a softsynth market that has evolved tremendously since the Virus line (even the current models) were introduced.

Yeah, but I don't think most plug-ins can compete with even the Virus C, let alone the range of options (and quality of them) in the TI. But I think their problems are twofold: first, they probably have to deal with bandwidth over usb connection, and probably the capacity of the chips to. But I'm one of the few who actually thinks that the changes between the C and TI - specially considering the additions on the latest updates - is huge and added many more possibilities to the Virus. Maybe so. But two extra envelopes, extra filters (the comb filter sounds very good), extra oscillators, character, cabinet emulations, reviewed distortion algorithms - all of that assignable as modulation destinations. The Nord Lead 4 has just been announced. It doesn't even have two filters you can use in series, it has less polyphony than the Virus C, envelopes are unipolar, just two previously assigned, and a simpler one for modulation - like on previous versions. And I don't see people bashing on that synthesizer as much as they do to the Virus. With just user drawable waves for oscillators and lfos, the Virus would be able to do what Massive does in terms of modulation (which is why it's so famous) and so much more. They're not far behind anything out there. LFO into audio range, selectable for FM usage would be nice to. Fade in and out on all of them to.

I'd like to see them implement better analogue emulation in the likes of Diva as well - if the extra power becomes available for more complex algorithms that are more demanding.

Maybe it's that Nord Lead and some other hardware synths seem geared toward the live performer, and that while the Virus is probably never in doubt as a live synth, as a studio synth it boasts "total integration" even in the product name itself, and therefore I guess expectations are that integration is what it says it is. Correct me if I'm wrong but I don't think the Nord Lead even tries to have the same level of integration, and is roughly 30% cheaper. I really don't remember hearing much bad press about the Virus C and prior models. It wasn't until "TI" came along as a feature, and I guess many felt that they were slow in delivering on what was promised or at least in some cases flippant toward the customer about it. Maybe "it's there" in terms of stability these days? I am certainly keeping one eye on the Virus and can see myself potentially caving in and buying one. Every now and then I look around for a good deal on a used C or KC so that I can re-enter the Viral waters with a little less of a money commitment.

I can't be sure this explains the bad press with the Virus, but I will say that during my career in software development, I've learned whenever you add a new feature, you have to make sure it works and works well. If it works some of the time or doesn't work as advertised, it would have been better to not add it at all and keep the feature set lean.

Now that I'm on Cubase for Windows, with a USB 3 card that I'm sure is not limiting the throughput, I'm very tempted to get another Virus and see how the integration works after some years of maturity.

I have to apologize, when I saw this post the first time, I went to Novation's page and saw the existing soundpacks only (might have had a cached version of the page maybe?) I read the reference to SuperNova sounds but did not see the reference on the page to the new soundpacks.

This is indeed new so I stand corrected! I will also be downloading this of course (have not yet done so).

Great to see they are still moving forward with support for the product line! (Now only if I had a Supernova to compare so I could A/B the sounds to be sure they're authentic :)

Update - sounds downloaded and they are VERY worthwhile! Much better than presets, more fun but also form useful basis for new patches and do a better job of showing the UltraNova off. There are only 64 sounds, but most are very good and there's supposedly more SuperNova sounds on the way. The default presets do tend to exploit the new features like touch knob animation better than the SuperNova patches, but it makes sense that this would be the case as the SuperNova didn't have that feature.

Anyone demoing an UltraNova or MiniNova in a store should demand these sounds be loaded onto it before deciding!

Glad those are useable! If I remember correctly, you got the FIRST free sound pack and when you re-registered for their new forum and/or "liked them" on Facebook, you then received another sound pack, but I could be wrong as my synapses are snapped these past few days:rolleyes: and because I too have been doing a complete studio ergonomic makeover, my happy blue Supernova 1 Rack is currently resting in a box. However, the best word that even Novation used to describe it's sound is pretty right-on is, "Liquid", in that very smooth/juicy filters for a VA but not the Virus' classic "Darker" sound, but again, not the violently craptasitic HAPPY sound a Korg has no matter how hard you try to make it even a tiny bit brooding. Hope that made sense!
I do not have the extended 44 voice SN but the very last OS update increased it to 24 and considering the 8 track, multi-timbre, polyphonic Arp can also drive external stuff with it's comprehensive midi specs--it's sound as well is reason I decided to hold onto it.
Sounds like the UltraNova is very programmable "under the hood" and too bad they did not offer a larger keyboard version of it and went "mini-me-keys" direction instead...I just do not understand appeal for extremely mini keys!:confused: I'd rather see innovation in having more upward near casing on each key, a touch/slider sensitive pad to go where after touch has never gone before or something:idea:

I think it would be interesting to see a rack version of it!

Question: can it do FM? I know the SuperNova 2 could, along with multi-trimbrality with separate effects per part and more voices then this one - somehow it still feels like a more powerful beast to me...

Not sure about the Facebook "liking", but if that's the case they can shove that scam, I'll get them some other way :) Those marketing ruses get on my nerves, and I think I'll let some other sheep cave into them; I wont.

Not quite sure what you mean by mini-me-keys, the UltraNova has full sized keys, it just only has 37 of them like the TI2 Polar. The MiniNova has smaller keys and is designed for those that want things more portable and at a lower cost (although the UN has dropped in cost since originally released so they are now only about $100 apart at street prices). I do see a lot of newer bands with tiny key synths on stage so there may be some sort of fashion trend behind it all that you and I aren't "getting".

About the sound, I think the UN has a characteristically gritty, in-your face sound that loves to go to obscure if not naughty places in your mix. It can be tamed easily and behaves when told, but it's kind of like always knocking at the door to the cage ready to bust out. It's been a long time since I've heard a SuperNova so it's very difficult to properly compare, but the first SuperNova patch bank does invoke memories of the SN to my ear.

The touch knobs on it, I think, are actually significantly more innovative than a touch slider, because of how many of them you can manipulate at once. One of my Cubase controllers has a nice touch fader (looks a lot like the ones in the Akai Max controller), and it's really just what it says, a fader with touch (good for controlling mix volume mostly). The touch knobs on the Ultranova actually lean you toward a different playing style that I have not seen on any other synth.

No, FM is just one of those things they've thus far decided not to do on this synth. They could add it, very easily to an OS update (there's nothing about the hardware to prevent it, just another menu option and UI changes to the VST) and maybe they will in the future, but for now that's one item it's lacking.

That's what I meant, the "MiniNova"...and realize I am off-base because totally different knob configuration and such with mininova.
I actually was going to ask you if there's a limit to how many parameters you can influence/change via the touch or is the engine such that it does not glitch if say you made a very long release and then just went mad touching knobs and such?
Lastly, is there any glitching in aforementioned scenario when connected in the vst? Do you HAVE to use the integration to deeply program or is all that available as a stand alone synth?

It's fully designed to be a stand-alone synth with emphasis on live play, you don't have to use the VST at all and you can get to all functions through the menus, but the display is just a one-liner at a time, so certain things would be infinitely more productive in the editor... For example the modulation matrix, you've got 20 slots with two potential sources (not counting the knob assignment) and one destination for each slot. Using only the synth you'd have to page through one mod slot at a time, on the editor you see 10 slots at a time (two pages of a grid) so it's more productive that way. Plus, you've got visualizations of things right there in front of you, like lets say LFO3 is a sine wave and you're using that as a source to modulate a filter on OSC2, well the actual rate of that sine wave, whether its free or synced etc is not going to be visible on that same line of the LCD display while making that mod slot assignment, but on the editor you'd have a graphic representation of the sine wave at the top of same screen to help keep things in context.

This could be irrelevant with simple modulations, but think about a situation where you get many of those going on (for the sake of knob assignments), and now remember that you can do things like modulate the rate of LFO3 with LFO1 via another mod slot! Lots of modulation options means lots of opportunity for losing track of what's what, and it's much easier to keep up with on the editor. You would just be menu diving more without the editor.

In terms of glitchy behavior with lots of weird knob modulations on patches with long release, no not at all, you can go nuts assuming no other technical issues going on. The only thing that feels slightly glitchy (impaired by MIDI itself I guess) to me are things like patch browsing through the editor, that require synchronization between the VST and the synth. You don't have to do that if you don't want though. And at the end of it, it's still smoother than my experience with the Virus editor.

It's not to say you couldn't encounter particular bugs. I saw someone saying that selecting certain waveforms in the editor was crashing the VST for him in Cubase. I've had no such problems in Cubase so I suspect he had something else going on, or maybe they've just patched it since (it was an older post).

Also looking back, not sure if I answered your question about # of params and knobs. Total of 20 mod slots, one knob per slot, 8 physical knobs but you can have a knob listed more than once (i.e. you could have a single knob modulating 20 different destinations if you wanted). Not sure if that answers your question though? Also in addition to the 8 knobs you still have aftertouch, the mod wheel, the "big" knob (good for filter sweeps) etc.

I've discovered something about this synth that seems odd to me, like a design flaw that's based more in hardware than software.

If I'm playing a sound and I have the "big knob" of the Ultranova set to cutoff filter (what most of us are likely to use it for), and during play I reach up and give it a firm and rapid counter-clockwise twist (for expressive reasons, to "dry" the cutoff quickly for effect while playing), I've noticed that the faster I twist it, the more likely it is to actually INCREMENT the filter cutoff than decrement it. For example if cutoff = 20, decrementing it too fast might actually leave you with a value of 24! In other words working the knob a little more slowly (for a more typical filter sweep) works as expected, but the knob cannot respond properly to extremely rapid motion.

A little disappointing considering its something I would consider as an acceptable fluke between (and admittedly I have not yet tried the latest OS update to see if it made a difference), but something like that takes away from "hardware as an instrument" vs. a softsynth + midi controller.

For example, if I just bind Automap to one of the pots on the MKII to the cutoff knob on the Ultranova VST, then do a rapid counterclockwise motion on the pot, the result is pretty much instantaneous... the filter never INCREMENTS when I'm rapidly telling it to DECREMENT.

Maybe this is just a fundamental flaw in the Ultranova hardware, or something they will fix in an OS revision......
....or maybe it's a fundamental flaw in the notion that interaction with dedicated hardware is better somehow than a MIDI controller of your choice + VST?

I would say this is something specific to the Ultranova, and maybe this particular buggy behavior is, but it actually pales in comparison to some of the nightmares I read about here getting the Virus to work properly. I guess the soft-synth world has spoiled me, I'm used to things now working as advertised.

I have a thought and I in NO WAY mean to inadvertently insult you superior knowledge above my own when I suggest this perhaps rather obvious oversight that's worth looking into.

Knowing from what I have read on various user posts and sound designer review comments on the UltraNova, that for instance with expression pedal assignments to particular CC's they are set-up in Global Menu *per program*, which is nice.
With that said, could it just be like on our other advanced synths such as the Virus series, Waldorf Q, and DSI Mono Evolver Keyboard, that you have perhaps deeper in Global Menu an option when using knobs with the UN in standalone to set those knobs to relevant, jump, as well as like on my Q where I can set-up per program OR globally whether turning knob incredibly fast will rather than stepping, be exponential? These kind of things are sometimes set to a default unless you make those changes yourself and very well could have been in a recent O.S. update you have already done or just something the user manual did not touch on but *may* exist already in a sub/sub menu page.
Just a thought and worth mentioning because your solution may well be there and if not, I am learning that Focusrite's Customer Support is really impressive. (my Scarlett 18i20 arrived today and can say am very pleased that their dedicated support for their products for a much larger company that Dave Smith Instruments is just as attentive and impressive as they have proven to be):-D Meaning, like DSI, Focusrite encourages user feedback and very often implements musician's suggestions if it's an oversight that is incredibly beneficial in their gear's user workflow!

I am definitely planning to investigate the issue a bit more. My few encounters with Novation tech support (one was Automap related, one was UltraNova related) did not seem to reflect the good customer support you've experienced on the audio interface side (I don't know if Novation/Focusrite support teams are merged or still treated as two different divisions, etc).

The issues I've put in with them take weeks to get even the simplest of resolutions resolved, because every time I respond, I have to wait 4-5 more days for their response, so the issue drags on and on. My most recent question (about Cubase running as admin) ended up being resolved by me, they were not even on the right path and they had already played pass the buck with the issue, transferring it from one support rep to another. Other issue with the Ultranova they did help me resolve but it still took way longer than something so simple should have.

Guess its a case of YMMV.

I think that even though parent company may or may not be Novation, there seems to be a distinct level of separation between the divisions and the brand newer web design and forum areas do not make that easily discernible as it was previously. The much longer ferrite A/B USB 2.0 cable arrived from Newegg. (Focusrite included a 3 Foot one and for a "rack mounted interface" it seemed a bit ridiculous to me for say the average user) Hoping this is my only gripe. Standard IEC power supply is nice. one thing do not really need another of is a line that looks like a snake swallowed my cat in the middle AND a wall wart, like ALL my Waldorf gear has consistently had. FYI--Focusrite has revamped almost entire Scarlett Line, even just last week officially discontinuing the Scarlett 18i6 to be replaced with new 18i8. I was even considering the 18i6 and would have been highly peeved and glad did my research thoroughly.

Could be just a faulty knob you have there. A friend of mine had a similar issue with a brand new Blofeld which got replaced and then everything worked fine. Don't know if they're the endless encoder type of Knobs or not, but I think these have a tendency to misbehave like that sometimes.

Anyhow, rapid tweaking is something everyone should do when test driving new hardware instruments I think.

Also know that Novation and Focusrite used (at least) to be one company in GB. They seem to have grown more independent from each other now - could be just an impression, never really checked.

But... is there any relationship between them and KRK? they seem to use their monitors in all their stands, demos and videos (not just them btw)...

@Berni: Wanted to let you know came across a notification that Novation has a major update for the UltraNova's Vocoder and you can read about it here:
http://en.audiofanzine.com/analog-mo...uly+20%2C+2013

Cheers!